Sep 03, 2025 9-3-2025 PB Meeting

[WORK SESSION ]

[00:00:06]

SO WE'RE GOING TO START THE WORK SESSION FOR THE SEPTEMBER 3RD, 2025 PLANNING BOARD MEETING. AND THIS EVENING WE HAVE OUR PRESENTER, MR. JOSH ROGERS, WHO IS GOING TO BE DISCUSSING CONTINUING THE DISCUSSION ON SOME ZONING CODE AMENDMENTS WHERE WE LEFT OFF LAST AND ETC. SO WITHOUT FURTHER ADO, THANK YOU. FOR MATTER OF THE RECORD, JOSHUA ROGERS, PLANNING DEPARTMENT. WE'RE ON THE THIRD ITERATION OF THE ZONING CODE AMENDMENTS.

JUST FOR A LITTLE BIT OF BACKGROUND AND IN TERMS OF NEXT STEPS, AS YOU GUYS RECALL, TWO PLANNING BOARD MEETINGS AGO, I PRESENTED THERE ARE SOME INDUSTRIAL ZONING DISTRICTS THAT WERE CLEANING UP IN THE TOWN, INCLUDING THE REMOVAL OF M1. AND THEN WE'RE ALSO PROPOSING SOME ZONING AMENDMENTS BECAUSE WE'RE REMOVING M1. AT THE LAST PLANNING BOARD MEETING, I PRESENTED TO YOU GUYS AN ADDITION OF A COMMERCIAL DISTRICT OVER IN THE LAKEVIEW AREA IN TOWN. AND WE WENT OVER A COUPLE OF ADDITIONS AND SOME RECOMMENDATIONS THAT THIS BOARD WANTED TO PRESENT TO THE TOWN BOARD. AND THEN TONIGHT I HAVE SOME OTHER CHAPTER 280 ZONING AMENDMENTS, SOME THAT CAME FROM SOME TOWN BOARD MEMBERS, SOME THAT CAME OUT OF OUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN IMPLEMENTATION COMMITTEE, SOME THAT CAME OUT OF OUR NON CFA ZONING CODE COMMITTEE. AND JUST TO KIND OF GIVE AN OVERVIEW OF WHAT THE NON CFA ZONING COMMITTEE IS, THE REASON IT'S CALLED NON CFA IS THE TOWN GOT CONSOLIDATED FUNDING APPLICATION GRANT FROM THE STATE OF NEW YORK FOR THE REVIEWING THE BILL STADIUM AREA, ALONG WITH THE MCKINLEY MALL AND A COUPLE OTHER AREAS IN THE TOWN. BUT THE TOWN ALSO RECEIVED SOME MONEY TO DO ZONING CLUB ZONING CODE UPDATES OUTSIDE OF THAT GRANT. SO WE JUST CALLED IT NON CFA. SO THAT'S WHAT THAT ACRONYM STANDS FOR. THERE'S A COMMITTEE THAT'S MADE UP OF MYSELF. THE PLANNING BOARD CHAIR IS ON THERE. WE HAVE A REPRESENTATIVE FROM THE ZONING BOARD REPRESENTATIVE FROM THE TOWN BOARD. SO IT'S A PRETTY DIVERSE GROUP THAT'S LOOKING AT ZONING CODE UPDATES. AND THESE ARE THE FIRST PHASE OF UPDATES THAT ARE PRESENTED TO THIS BOARD FOR RECOMMENDATION. BACK TO THE TOWN BOARD IN TERMS OF NEXT STEPS AFTER THIS MEETING TONIGHT, THERE IS A PUBLIC HEARING ON THE INDUSTRIAL ZONING RECOMMENDATIONS THAT YOU GUYS PROVIDED ON SEPTEMBER 8TH.

AND THEN ON SEPTEMBER 22ND WILL BE THE PUBLIC HEARING FOR THE LAKEVIEW COMMERCIAL DISTRICT AREA. AND THEN THESE AMENDMENTS THAT I'M GOING TO TALK ABOUT TONIGHT. AND THEN FROM THERE, THERE CAN BE SOME FURTHER CHANGES IN THE BOARD. THE TOWN BOARD WILL EVENTUALLY TAKE A VOTE ON THOSE AMENDMENTS FOR TONIGHT. EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE A TON OF PAPERWORK BEFORE I GO FORWARD. DOES PRINTING IT OUT IS THAT HELPFUL FOR THE BOARD? WOULD YOU PREFER I JUST DO IT ONLINE OR ON THE ON THE SCREEN? I DON'T KNOW IF EITHER OR WORKS, BUT I TRY TO PRINT THEM OUT JUST SO THAT YOU CAN KIND OF FOLLOW ALONG WITH WHAT I'M PRESENTING. AND THEN I'LL KIND OF JUST GO OVER THOSE, AND THEN I HAVE TO TAKE ANY NOTES, AND THEN WE'LL, WE'LL GET STARTED WITH THE REGULAR MEETING, THE FIRST CODE AMENDMENT THAT I'LL GET STARTED WITH IS YOU SHOULD SEE THERE'S ONE PAGE 282 NINE SPECIAL REGULATIONS FOR TOWNHOMES. IN TERMS OF THE PROCESS, I WILL KIND OF GIVE A LITTLE BIT OF BACKGROUND WHERE IT CAME FROM, WHAT THE RECOMMENDATION IS, AND THEN I'LL KIND OF JUST OPEN THE FLOOR FOR FOR BOARD TO BOARD COMMENT FOR TWO 8289 THIS CAME OUT OF THE NON CFA COMMITTEE THAT I MENTIONED, AND ALSO SOME FROM SOME TOWN BOARD MEMBERS. THERE HAS BEEN A CONCERN THAT'S BEEN PROVIDED TO NUMEROUS TOWN BOARD MEETINGS OF THE AMOUNT OF RECREATION SPACE AND OPEN SPACE. WHEN WE WE'VE HAD A COUPLE OF TOWNHOME DEVELOPMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN APPROVED THROUGH THE PLANNING BOARD OVER THE PAST COUPLE OF YEARS, AND THERE WERE SOME CONCERNS SLASH SOME SUGGESTIONS FOR ADDING LANGUAGE TO THE CODE SPECIFIC TO THE TOWNHOMES REGULATIONS. IF YOU GUYS RECALL, TOWNHOUSE SUBDIVISIONS. TOWNHOUSES ARE CONSIDERED SUBDIVISIONS IN THE TOWN OF HAMBURG. I'LL USE THE BRIARCLIFF PROJECT AS AN EXAMPLE. IT WAS ENDED UP BEING 55 UNITS, BUT WE TREATED IT AS A MAJOR SUBDIVISION. AND BECAUSE IT'S A TOWNHOUSE, TOWNHOUSES ARE DIFFERENT. IN THE TOWN OF HAMBURG, WE HAVE SPECIFIC RECREATION REQUIREMENTS FOR TOWNHOUSES, BUT WE ALSO HAVE RECREATION REQUIREMENTS FOR SUBDIVISION OF LAND. SO THIS FIRST AMENDMENT TO TWO 8289, THIS IS, LIKE I SAID, SPECIFIC TO THE TOWNHOUSE REGULATIONS. IF YOU LOOK AT THE LETTER M RECREATION SPACE. SO IT TALKS ABOUT THE NO LESS THAN THE 500FT■!S OF SPACE PER DWELLG UNIT FOR TOWNHOUSES. AND THE ADDITION SAYS THAT THESE PRIVATE RECREATIONAL LANDS ARE NOT IN LIEU OF THE SUBDIVISION CODE REQUIREMENTS OF PUBLIC RECREATION LAND REQUIREMENTS.

SEE CHAPTER 230 SUBDIVISION OF LAND. SO THE THINKING BEHIND THIS WAS WE'VE HAD SOME PROJECTS BEFORE WHERE PEOPLE HAVE COME FOR TOWNHOUSES AND HAVE ARGUED THAT THEY MEET, YOU KNOW, THE TOWNHOUSE RECREATION SPACE REQUIREMENT AND THAT SHOULD SUFFICE. AND THAT'S, YOU KNOW, THAT'S THE ONLY THING THEY NEED TO MEET. WE ADDED LANGUAGE TO THE TOWNHOUSE REGULATIONS THAT SAYS YOU'RE GOING TO MEET ARTICLE LETTER M, THE RECREATION SPACE. THERE'S

[00:05:01]

YEAH. ONE QUESTION. HOPEFULLY I'M PROPERLY ON MEMBER MCCORMICK. ARE WE GOING TO DO ANY SORT OF CLARIFICATION HOLISTICALLY? IN ADDITION TO THIS CONCERN, WE HAVE GONE BACK AND FORTH ABOUT WHAT COUNTS AS ACTIVE AND PASSIVE RECREATIONAL SPACE AS WELL AS I DON'T KNOW IF WE'RE GONNA GET THAT SOMEWHERE ELSE AS WELL, AS THERE WERE CASES OF STORMWATER FACILITIES BEING COUNTED AS PASSIVE RECREATION SPACE OR UNDEVELOPED SPACE. SO IS THAT GOING TO GET ADDRESSED ELSEWHERE AS PART OF THESE CODE REVISIONS? YES. SO IN PHASE TWO, LUCKY ME, I GET TO PROVIDE OR BRING BACK SUBDIVISION OF LAND. THE ENTIRE CHAPTER BACK TO THIS BOARD. IF YOU GUYS RECALL, WE'VE TAKEN A LOOK AT IT A LITTLE BIT. I, I PRESENTED IT, I WANT TO SAY, IN FEBRUARY OR MARCH OF THIS YEAR. AND WE ALSO DID A SITE PLAN REVIEW, SITE PLAN REVIEW. I THINK WE REALLY IRONED OUT SUBDIVISION OF LAND. WE GOT TO A CERTAIN POINT, AND I THINK WE GOT TO THIS TOWNHOUSE, PART OF THE SUBDIVISION OF LAND CODE, NOT ONLY ABOUT WHAT HOW DO WE WANT TO DEFINE TOWNHOMES, BUT WE STARTED TALKING ABOUT THIS RECREATION SPACE. SO THAT'LL BE THIS IS JUST AN INITIAL RECOMMENDATION, BUT THAT WILL BE IRONED OUT WHEN I BRING BACK SUBDIVISION OF LAND BACK TO TO THE BOARD. AND THAT'LL BE IN PHASE TWO OF THE SAME NON-CF ZONING CODE UPDATES. IT WILL DEFINITELY BE WITH THAT. THANK YOU. YEP. NO PROBLEM. THIS WASN'T MY ONLY SHOT AT THE THE NEXT PART THAT I'LL GO OVER.

YOU GUYS SHOULD SEE 284 SIX. THE TITLE OF IT IS MINIMUM LOT SIZE. THIS PART OF THE CODE COMES FROM OUR R-3 MULTIFAMILY DISTRICT. SO JUST TO GIVE A LITTLE BIT BACKGROUND, THE MULTIFAMILY DISTRICT R3 IN THE TOWN OF HAMBURG HAS GOTTEN A LOT OF INTEREST, ESPECIALLY WITH SOME DEVELOPMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN RECENTLY REZONED TO THAT DISTRICT AND SOME OTHER DIFFERENT PROPOSALS THAT HAVE BEEN APPROVED WITHIN THAT DISTRICT. AS YOU GUYS KNOW, R-3 ALLOWS SINGLE FAMILY HOMES AND IT ALLOWS TWO FAMILY HOMES, BUT IT ALSO ALLOWS MULTI-FAMILY DEVELOPMENT, WHICH IN THE TOWN IS THREE UNITS OR MORE. AND ONE OF THE THINGS THAT CAME OUT OF SOME CONVERSATIONS WITH NOT ONLY WITH THAT ZONING CODE COMMITTEE, BUT WITH SOME CONVERSATIONS WITH TOWN BOARD MEMBERS, ALSO BASED OFF OF SOME OF PUBLIC INTEREST AT SOME TOWN BOARD MEETINGS, WAS TAKING A LOOK AT THE R3 DISTRICT, ESPECIALLY THE MINIMUM LOT SIZE, AND ADDING SOME LANGUAGE RELATED TO DENSITY, AND ALSO RELATED TO SOME OPEN SPACE WITHIN THE R3 DISTRICT ITSELF. SO IF YOU LOOK AT THE CODE THAT YOU HAVE IN FRONT OF YOU, MINIMUM LOT SIZE. SO LIKE I SAID, THIS IS OUT OF THE R3 DISTRICT 284 SIX IS THE MINIMUM LOT SIZE AND THE R3 DISTRICT. THE CHANGES THAT YOU'LL SEE ARE THAT FOR 3 OR 4 FAMILY DWELLINGS, THAT LANGUAGE HAS STAYED THE SAME OF THERE'S NO MINIMUM LOT SIZE. BUT THEN THERE WAS A PHRASE ADDED DENSITY SHALL BE DETERMINED BASED ON COMPLIANCE WITH ALL OTHER MINIMUM SETBACKS, OPEN SPACE AND OTHER REQUIREMENTS OF THE TOWN CODE. THE PARCEL OF LAND FOR PERMITTED USE SHALL BE SUFFICIENT IN SIZE TO ADEQUATELY ACCOMMODATE BUILDINGS. REQUIRED PARKING, OPEN SPACE, RECREATION, LANDSCAPING, AND OTHER ACCESSORY USES AS DICTATED BY ALL OTHER BULK REGULATIONS AND OTHER APPLICABLE SECTIONS OF THE CODE. AND THEN YOU'LL ALSO SEE THAT THAT SAME LANGUAGE IS ALSO ADDED TO WHETHER THREE OR MORE FAMILY DWELLINGS ARE LESS THAN THREE STORIES, OR WHETHER 3 OR 4 DWELLINGS ARE MORE THAN THREE STORIES. BOTH OF THAT LANGUAGE IS THE SAME FOR BOTH. AND AS I SAID, WHERE THIS CAME FROM WAS THERE HAVE BEEN SOME CONCERNS FROM NOT ONLY THE PUBLIC, BUT FROM TOWN BOARD MEMBERS ABOUT DENSITY WITHIN THE TOWN SPECIFIC TO THE R3 DISTRICT. THERE HAVE BEEN, LIKE I SAID, A NUMBER OF MULTI-FAMILY DEVELOPMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN APPROVED RECENTLY.

AND THE THE COMMITTEE CAME TOGETHER AND ADDED THIS LANGUAGE AS A RECOMMENDATION TO THEN PROVIDE TO THE PLANNING BOARD FOR YOUR GUYS'S THOUGHTS BEFORE IT GOES TO THE TOWN BOARD OF SOME SOME LANGUAGE THAT THEY WANTED TO ADD TO THE R3 DISTRICT SPECIFIC TO DENSITY, ANY THOUGHTS, QUESTIONS, OR REVISIONS ON THIS PART OF THE CODE? NO, I THINK YOU'RE GOOD.

JUST REAL QUICK. COULD YOU RUN THROUGH IF SOMEBODY YOU KNOW HOW THEN HOW THIS KIND OF WORKFLOW WORKS? IF YOU'RE SAYING IF YOU'RE REFERRING TO ALL OF THE BULK REGULATIONS, LIKE HOW WOULD THEN SOMEBODY KIND OF WORK THROUGH DETERMINING. THEIR, YOU KNOW, THE REQUIREMENTS. SO HOW IT'S SUPPOSED TO WORK IS THAT OBVIOUSLY DENSITY OR WHAT

[00:10:03]

CONSIDERING, YOU KNOW, THESE MULTI-FAMILY DEVELOPMENTS OKAY. GOT IT. I JUST BECAUSE LIKE READING IT LIKE OUTSIDE OF THE ENTIRETY OF THE CODE IT'S LIKE WELL THEN WHAT'S NEXT. BUT NOW THAT MAKES MORE SENSE. YEAH THANKS. OKAY I'LL MOVE ON TO YOU GUYS. SHOULD SEE 280 DASH 60 TITLED PERMITTED USES AND STRUCTURES. REAL QUICK ON THE BACK OF. OH, SORRY. YEAH, I DIDN'T GET TO SPACE. SORRY. SO ANOTHER ADDITION TO THE R3 DISTRICT IS WE'VE JUST TALKED ABOUT CONCERNED WITH OPEN SPACE AND RECREATION REQUIREMENTS. SO THIS COMMITTEE ALSO WANTED TO ADD A PROVISION INTO THE ACTUAL DISTRICT ITSELF ABOUT A NEW ARTICLE OR SORRY, A NEW SUBHEADING FOR OPEN SPACE AND RECREATION REQUIREMENTS FOR THESE MULTI-FAMILY DEVELOPMENTS.

AND IT READS AS AS FOLLOWS A WILL SAY ALL PROPOSALS FOR MULTI-FAMILY USES. THAT'S 3 OR 4, THREE OR MORE FAMILY DWELLINGS WILL INCLUDE A MINIMUM OF 20% GREEN SPACE. AND IT SPECIFIES THAT AS AREAS THAT ARE TREED, LAWN OR LANDSCAPED TO THE SATISFACTION OF THE PLANNING BOARD, AND THEN ALSO SAYS ALL PROPOSALS FOR MULTI-FAMILY USES MUST INCLUDE A RECREATION SPACE IN ACCORDANCE WITH 282 70.1 OF THE ZONING CODE, WHICH I BELIEVE IS ALSO ANOTHER RECREATIONAL AND OPEN SPACE REQUIREMENT. PART OF THE CODE. SO THE THIS SUBSECTION BASICALLY STATES THAT ANY MULTIFAMILY DEVELOPMENT IN THE TOWN, IN AN R3 DISTRICT, WILL NEED TO HAVE A MINIMUM OF 20% OF GREEN SPACE. NOW, KIND OF GOING BACK TO YOUR POINT, MISS MCCORMICK, ONE THING THAT I'M NOTING IS THAT IT SAYS AREAS THAT ARE TREATED UNDER LANDSCAPE, TO THE SATISFACTION OF THE PLANNING BOARD. THEY TRY TO GIVE SOME DISCRETION TO THE BOARD. BUT I GUESS THE QUESTION IS WHAT DOES GREEN SPACE MEAN? I KNOW NO, WE'VE HAD PROPOSALS WHERE OUR CLIFFS, GREEN SPACE, OUR WETLANDS, GREEN SPACE, OUR THERE'S A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT. THE TOWN IS UNIQUE WHERE THERE'S A LOT OF UNIQUE PARCELS IN THE TOWN. SO OBVIOUSLY WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET IT PERFECT WHERE THERE'S ALWAYS GOING TO BE SOME SORT OF DEVELOPMENT THAT HAS, YOU KNOW, A UNIQUE GEOGRAPHIC FEATURE THAT MAY OR MAY NOT BE CONSIDERED GREEN SPACE. SO SOMETHING THAT I'M NOTING AS WE'RE TALKING THROUGH THIS IS THAT WE MIGHT NEED TO EITHER SPECIFY WHAT WE MEAN WHEN WE SAY GREEN SPACE AT A DEFINITION, OR I DON'T KNOW IF WE CAN LEAVE IT UP TO THE PLANNING BOARD'S DISCRETION, BUT I THINK IT PUTS THE PLANNING BOARD AND FUTURE PLANNING BOARDS AT A TOUGH SPOT BY JUST GIVING, LETTING, LETTING THE BOARD DECIDE, WELL, WHAT IS GREEN SPACE? THAT SEEMS A LITTLE BIT ARBITRARY, SAYING, WELL, THIS IS GREEN SPACE. AND THEN WE GET ANOTHER DEVELOPMENT AND WE'RE SAYING THAT'S NOT GREEN SPACE, ESPECIALLY IF WE'RE PUTTING A 20% MINIMUM CAP.

SO THOSE ARE JUST THOUGHTS THAT I'M THINKING OF AS, AS WE MENTIONED. ARE THERE ANY THOUGHTS TO TO THIS PART OF THE CODE? JOSH, I THINK THAT 20% NEEDS TO BE DEFINED. I DON'T THINK IT SHOULD BE A PERCENTAGE. I THINK IT SHOULD BE. AND WE'RE NOT GOING TO DO IT TONIGHT. AND I DON'T WANT TO BELABOR IT, BUT I'D LIKE TO TABLE THIS FOR FURTHER DISCUSSION ON 20% AND DEFINITION OF GREEN SPACE. I'D LIKE I THINK THAT THE PLANNING BOARD, THIS BOARD IN PARTICULAR, SHOULD LOOK AT THAT AND GIVE IT SOME THOUGHT, BECAUSE THIS IS THE BOARD THAT'S GOING TO DEAL WITH IT, AND I DON'T THINK IT SHOULD BE 20%. I THINK IT SHOULD BE EITHER ACREAGE OR SOMETHING MORE SPECIFIC, BECAUSE WHO'S GOING TO GO OUT AND MEASURE 20% ON A HUNDRED ACRE PIECE OF PARCEL THAT WOULD BE CALLED OUT IN YOUR SITE PLAN IN YOUR IN YOUR SITE PLAN.

RIGHT. LIKE YOU'RE. YEAH. WHAT THE HECK IS THAT TABLE CALLED QUANTIFIABLE. YOU THINK? YEAH, I THINK THAT'S A LOT EASIER THAN A FIXED ACREAGE BECAUSE AS THE SITE SCALES, YOU'RE GOING TO GET UP TO A MIC. I THINK MY MIC IS, OH, MAYBE IT IS WORKING. IT'S WORKING. I THINK THAT HAVING IT AS A PERCENTAGE, IT'S GOING TO HAVE TO BE IDENTIFIED. AND THEN THEY'LL HAVE TO CALCULATE. SO AS YOU GET LARGER SITES, IT'S GOING TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY DON'T END UP WITH LIKE ONE ACRE WHEN THEY SHOULD HAVE 20 ACRES. BUT I AGREE THAT WE SHOULD SPEND SOME TIME. I THINK THIS NEEDS TO BE THAT. YEAH. JUST BUILDING ON WHAT YOU SAID, CHAIR. I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE, AND ONE THAT HAS COME UP MANY TIMES, IS I THINK WE NEED TO SPECIFICALLY NOTE THAT THIS GREEN SPACE DOES NOT INCLUDE ANY STORMWATER FACILITIES, EVEN IF THEY'RE PLANTED IN VEGETATED. SO NO STORMWATER PONDS. STORMWATER BASINS, CATCHMENT

[00:15:02]

THEY HAVE SOME VEGETATION THERE, BUT THAT'S THEIR STORMWATER FACILITIES THAT ARE REQUIRED TO BE THERE. THEY'RE ENGINEERED, THEY'RE DESIGNED. AND I THINK WE JUST NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT IS AND MAYBE THE GREEN SPACE CANNOT HAVE I DON'T KNOW HOW I'M GOING TO WORD THIS, BUT CAN'T HAVE A DUAL PURPOSE ON THE LOT. SO IT CAN'T BE STORMWATER AND GREEN SPACE. IT CAN'T BE. A PARK AND GREEN SPACE. YEAH. SO IT'S A WALKING TRAIL, RIGHT? WELL BUT THAT'S DIFFERENT THAN STORMWATER RIGHT. SO IN A WALKING TRAIL WOULD BE PART OF THE GREEN SPACE. THAT BUT THAT'S WHY I THINK I DON'T WANT TO BELABOR THIS. I THINK THAT WE SHOULD TABLE THIS AND THE BOARD SHOULD HAVE TIME TO DISCUSS THOSE. BUT THOSE ARE GOOD THINGS TO BRING UP. YEAH I WOULD I WOULD AGREE THAT SHALL NOT INCLUDE LIST WOULD BE THE RIGHT DO IT. OKAY. YEP. WE NEED TO WORK ON THAT PART. NO WORRIES OKAY. NEXT 280 DASH 60. THESE ARE PERMITTED USES AND STRUCTURES IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD COMMERCIAL DISTRICT. LET'S GIVE A LITTLE BIT OF BACKGROUND ON WHERE THIS CAME FROM, WHERE MULTIFAMILY DEVELOPMENT IS ALLOWED IN THE TOWN OF HAMBURG IS IN R3, LIKE I JUST MENTIONED. YOU CAN DO IT IN THE PUD. IF YOU HAVE ENOUGH ACREAGE, YOU CAN DO IT IN OUR MU1 DISTRICT, WHICH AS YOU GUYS KNOW IS A FLOATING ZONE. IT GOES TO THE TOWN BOARD, TO THIS BOARD FOR RECOMMENDATION. BACK TO THE TOWN BOARD. YOU CAN DO A PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT OR A PLANNED RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT, AND YOU CAN ALSO DO MULTIFAMILY DEVELOPMENT IN NEIGHBORHOOD COMMERCIAL, BECAUSE NEIGHBORHOOD COMMERCIAL ALLOWS PRINCIPAL USES PERMITTED IN THE R3 DISTRICT. YOU GUYS WILL SEE THAT IN A1. AND THROUGH THIS CONVERSATION OF, YOU KNOW, LIKE I SAID, MULTIFAMILY DEVELOPMENT HAS BEEN A HUGE TALKING POINT WITHIN THE TOWN. AND THROUGH LOOKING AT NOT ONLY THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, BUT ALSO LOOKING AT THE EXISTING NEIGHBORHOOD COMMERCIAL DISTRICT. IF YOU LOOK AT THE INTENT OF NEIGHBORHOOD COMMERCIAL, IT'S FOR THE EVERYDAY SHOPPING NEEDS OF A NEIGHBORHOOD. SMALLER, LOWER, INTENSE COMMERCIAL USES. AND THROUGH THE COMMITTEE AND THROUGH SOME TALKING WITH THE TOWN BOARD, THERE WAS THE RECOMMENDATION TO REMOVE OUR THREE USES FROM THE NEIGHBORHOOD COMMERCIAL DISTRICT ENTIRELY, BUT STILL ALLOW SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED DETACHED DWELLINGS AND TWO FAMILY DWELLINGS. SO YOU'LL SEE IN TWO 8060 A THE RECOMMENDATION IS TO REMOVE PRINCIPAL USE NUMBER ONE, WHICH ALLOWS PRINCIPAL USES AND STRUCTURES IN THE R3 DISTRICT, BUT DOES THEN SPECIFY AND SPELL OUT SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED DWELLINGS AND DOES SPELL OUT TWO FAMILY DWELLINGS. YOU'LL ALSO SEE UNDER TWO, 80 6016, WHICH ARE FOLLOWING USES ALLOWED BY SPECIAL USE PERMIT AUTHORIZED BY THIS PLANNING BOARD. BANKS AND DRIVE THROUGH BANKS ARE ALLOWED, AND WE ADDED A PROVISION FOR MIXED USE BUILDINGS WHICH ALLOW WITHIN ALLOWED COMMERCIAL DISTRICT OR A COMMERCIAL USE WITHIN THIS DISTRICT, WITH UP TO FOUR RESIDENTIAL UNITS ON THE SECOND FLOOR. THE REASON WHY WE ADDED THIS IS, IF YOU GUYS RECALL, WE STARTED TO GET A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT PROJECTS FOR LIKE EXAMPLE, THE GYM OVER ON RALEIGH BOULEVARD. NOW THAT WAS ZONED MU ONE AND RATHER RIGHT NOW TO DO A MIXED USE BUILDING. IN ESSENCE, YOU REALLY CAN ONLY GO THROUGH THE MU ONE DISTRICT. YOU CAN TECHNICALLY DO IT THROUGH WATERFRONT COMMERCIAL, WHICH ALLOWS FOR 50% OF RESIDENTIAL AND A COMMERCIAL USE, BUT THAT'S SPECIFIC TO THE WATERFRONT. IF YOU'RE OUTSIDE THE WATERFRONT, WHERE ELSE CAN YOU DO MIXED USE IN THE TOWN? RIGHT NOW, YOU CAN ONLY DO IT THROUGH MU ONE. WE'RE LOOKING AT THE NEIGHBORHOOD COMMERCIAL DISTRICT AND ITS INTENT AND WHERE IT IS LOCATED WITHIN THE TOWN. WHILE WE'RE REMOVING THE PRINCIPAL USES FROM R3 AND ALLOWING SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED AND TWO FAMILY DETACHED DWELLINGS, WE ALSO WANTED TO PROVIDE AN OPPORTUNITY FOR THOSE THAT ARE HAVING KIND OF THIS LOWER INTENSITY COMMERCIAL USE TO PUT, YOU KNOW, A COUPLE APARTMENT UNITS ABOVE THEIR STORE OR ABOVE THEIR GYM OR ABOVE, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER'S ALLOWED IN NC. SO WE ADDED THAT WITH THE CAVEAT THAT THEY STILL NEED TO GET A SPECIAL USE PERMIT BY THIS BOARD. SO IT'S NOT GOING TO BE AS OF RIGHT. THEY'RE GOING TO BE CONDITIONS WITHIN THAT SPECIAL USE PERMIT THAT THIS BOARD WILL WILL HOLD THAT APPLICANT TO. BUT THAT'S KIND OF THE THINKING OF WANTING TO LOOK AT THE NC DISTRICT. I ACTUALLY HAVE A MAP ON THE SCREEN FOR YOU GUYS. ALRIGHT.

HERE. SO JUST TO ORIENT EVERYONE IN THE CROWD AND ALSO FOR THE BOARD, WHAT YOU SEE IS A MAP OF NEIGHBORHOOD, COMMERCIAL AND R3 ZONING IN THE TOWN. RIGHT NOW THE ORANGE IS EXISTING R3. KEEP IN MIND THAT SOME OF THAT R3 WILL PROBABLY CHANGE WHEN ONE EXAMPLE OF THAT IS THE PROPERTY THAT IS A HUGE CHUNK OF R3 THAT HAS THE POTENTIAL TO CHANGE IN THE FUTURE. A LOT OF R3 THAT YOU'LL SEE IS UP IN WOODLAWN, FOR EXAMPLE, WHICH IS AN ALREADY DEVELOPED NEIGHBORHOOD. SO THERE ARE A LOT OF SINGLE FAMILY HOMES. SO A LOT OF THIS R3 THAT YOU SEE EITHER IS ALREADY DEVELOPED OR IS GOING TO CONTINUE TO CHANGE. AND THEN

[00:20:05]

[00:25:03]

I DON'T KNOW IF ANYONE HAS ANY THOUGHTS ON WHETHER UNITS MAKE SENSE OR SQUARE FOOTAGE, OR HOW YOU WANT TO CAP THAT INTENT OF NOT, YOU KNOW, LARGE SCALE, MIXED USE BUILDINGS. BUT YOU KNOW, SOMETHING THAT MEETS THE INTENT OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD COMMERCIAL DISTRICT. I THINK UNITS IS FINE. I MEAN, I'M FINE WITH THE FOUR. I DON'T KNOW HOW EVERYBODY ELSE FEELS, BUT I THINK IT MEETS THE, THE SPIRIT OF THE, OF THE WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO HERE, WHICH IS WHEN YOU LOOK AT THESE AREAS, THEY'RE REALLY CAN'T. THEY CAN'T CARRY A LARGER BUSINESS WITH TEN APARTMENTS. AND I DON'T THINK THAT THAT'S WHAT THIS THE SPIRIT OF THIS ORDINANCE IS ABOUT THAT THAT'S HOW I LOOK AT IT. SO IT JUST IT IT KIND OF HELPS THE MIXED USE, THE WAY I LOOK AT IT IS THAT IT HELPS THE BUSINESS OWNER TO RECOUP SOME OF THAT. I KNOW WE'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO TALK ABOUT FINANCIAL, BUT YOU KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING? FROM AN OWNER AND A BUSINESS USE. I'M SORRY. WHEN WE REVIEWING STATE LAWS CHANGES, I THINK WE CAN TALK ABOUT THOSE THINGS. YEAH, WELL, YOU NEED TO USE YOUR MICROPHONE BECAUSE NOBODY CAN HEAR YOU AT HOME. WHEN WE'RE REVIEWING THE CHANGES IN THE LAWS. I THINK THAT'S FAIR GAME TO DISCUSS THE FINANCIAL IMPACTS. THAT'S WHAT I WAS THINKING ABOUT WITH THE FOUR UNITS AND THE MIXED USE.

THAT'S HOW I LOOKED AT IT. AND IT'S MINIMAL. IT'S NOT A HIGH IMPACT INTO THE AREA. AND WHEN YOU LOOK AT THAT MAP, IT'S NOT REALLY AN AREA THAT'S GOING TO FIT A HUGE AMOUNT OF THAT KIND OF THING. I CHAIR I MEMBER MCCORMACK. SURE. I AGREE WITH YOU. I THINK THE OTHER THING IS, IS, WELL, THAT'S TWICE IN ONE NIGHT I'M GOING TO I GOTTA GET MY DIARY OUT. SO I THINK THAT THAT MAKES SENSE. AND SOME OF THESE OTHER USES MAY HAVE MORE THAN 2000FT■!S. YOU KNOW, YOU MY HAVE A FUNERAL HOME OR A MEDICAL BUILDING THAT'S SLIGHTLY BIGGER THAN THAT FOR ONE REASON OR ANOTHER. AND I THINK, RIGHT, CAPPING THOUGH, THE NUMBER OF UNITS, I THINK THE BUILDING SIZE WILL NATURALLY DO THAT IN SOME OF THESE USES, BUT I THINK IT KEEPS IT FROM BEING AN APARTMENT, LARGE SCALE APARTMENT COMPLEX. AND THEN THE ONLY OTHER THING FOR NEIGHBORHOOD COMMERCIAL, IF YOU TURN TO THE BACK OF THE PAGE TWO 8061 MINIMUM LOT SIZE, WE JUST REMOVED 3 OR 4 MORE FAMILY DWELLINGS, THOSE MINIMUM LOT SIZES. AND THEN FOR LOT AREA UNDER SUBSECTION 3A3 WE SAID FOR NON RESIDENTIAL USES AND MIXED USE BUILDINGS. JUST SAYING THAT A LOT OF AREAS WILL BE BASED ON THE SIZE OF THE BUILDING, PARKING, LANDSCAPING AND ALL THE OTHER ZONING REQUIREMENTS. SO JUST CLEANING THAT UP. OKAY. LAST BUT NOT LEAST IS THE PAGE THAT YOU HAVE THAT HAS A STAPLE IN IT. THESE ARE THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT STANDARDS WITHIN THE TOWN. SOMETHING ELSE THAT THE TOWN HAS BEEN LOOKING AT IS IF YOU SCROLL ON FACEBOOK OR IF YOU JUST TALK TO SOMEBODY AT YOUR LOCAL TOPS, YOU'LL HEAR THAT THE TOWN OF HAMBURG IS NOTHING BUT CAR WASHES AND PRIVATE RENTAL, MINI STORAGE AND APARTMENTS AND THAT'S IT. AND BECAUSE OF THAT, WE TAKE, YOU KNOW, WE DO TAKE THOSE COMMENTS AND WE TAKE THAT PUBLIC INPUT AND WE TAKE WE LOOK AT OUR ZONING CODE AND WE LOOK AT WHAT'S AROUND THE TOWN. AND WE TAKE THOSE COMMENTS SERIOUSLY, AND WE LOOK TO SEE, YOU KNOW, WHETHER THAT HAS MERIT. AND WE LOOK TO SEE WHAT CAN WE DO TO, YOU KNOW, MAKE THE TOWN CODE REFLECT WHAT HAMBURG EXISTS AS RIGHT NOW, BUT ALSO PLAN FOR THE FUTURE. AND WHAT THIS COMMITTEE HAS DONE IS LOOKED AT SOME OF THOSE SPECIAL USE PERMIT STANDARDS AND WANTED TO ADD A LITTLE BIT MORE LANGUAGE TO IT. SO THE FIRST ONE THAT YOU'LL SEE AT 280 329 COMMERCIAL CAR WASHES. I HAVE A MAP FOR YOU GUYS. ONE THING THAT I LIKE TO DO IS PROVIDE VISUALS, BECAUSE IT'S ONE THING TO TALK ABOUT A CODE, ABOUT AN ISSUE IN THE TOWN AND SAYING THAT THERE'S TOO MUCH OF X, AND THERE'S ANOTHER THING TO ACTUALLY MAP IT OUT DO THE DATA, GET THE DATA, SEE WHERE IT IS SPATIALLY WITHIN THE TOWN TO REALLY SEE, YOU KNOW, IS IT AN ISSUE OR NOT? I'LL PASS THIS AROUND FOR EVERYONE TO SEE. BUT THIS IS A MAP THAT WE PROVIDED OF WHAT IS A CAR WASH THAT'S IN A BLACK ICON, AND THEN A DETAILING SERVICE AND A BLUE ICON. AND THEN YOU CAN SEE IT SPATIALLY WITHIN THE TOWN OF HAMBURG, WE EXCLUDED THE VILLAGE ABLAZE DOWN THE VILLAGE OF HAMBURG. AS YOU'RE TAKING A LOOK AT THAT, WHAT WE WANTED TO DO, AS YOU SEE THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT STANDARDS. SO JUST TO GIVE A LITTLE BIT OF BACKGROUND CAR WASHES ARE ALLOWED ONLY IN C2 IN THE TOWN OF HAMBURG. THEY NEED A SPECIAL USE PERMIT FROM THIS BOARD. WHAT THIS CODE REVISIONS WOULD DO WOULD BE CHANGING SOME OF THE LANGUAGE WITHIN THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT STANDARDS FOR A CAR WASH. IF YOU LOOK AT 283 232 NINE RIGHT NOW FOR A COMMERCIAL CAR WASH, YOU HAVE TO MEET THE STANDARD FOR CRITERIA FOR A SPECIAL USE PERMIT IN THE TOWN. THAT'S REGARDLESS OF ANY USE. AND THEN YOU LOOK AT WHAT SPECIFIC THE CAR WASHES. THE CHANGE THAT YOU'LL SEE IS A NO NEW COMMERCIAL CAR WASHES TO BE CONSTRUCTED AFTER THE ADOPTION. ADOPTION OF THIS LOCAL LAW

[00:30:05]

BUT I THINK IT SHOULD BE 1000FT FROM A RESIDENT, ESPECIALLY WITH I MEAN, WE LISTEN TO THESE RESIDENTS WHEN THEY CAME IN FRONT OF US AND THEY HAD VALID, VALID CONCERNS. AND I DON'T THINK THAT 500FT WHEN IT COMES TO A RESIDENT AND A CAR WASH, GIVEN ALL THE INFORMATION AND THE SOUNDS OF THE DRYERS AND THE DECIBELS AND ALL OF THAT, I THINK IT SHOULD BE 1000FT. OKAY.

ANY OTHER THOUGHTS ON THAT? THAT SPECIFIC POINT ABOUT HOW MANY FEET AWAY FROM A RESIDENCE? HOW MANY FEET AWAY FROM ANOTHER CAR WASH? THIS IS CAITLIN MEMBER MCCORMICK. I WOULD AGREE.

OH MY GOSH, I THINK THAT WE NEED TO IT MAYBE UNDERSTANDING WHERE WE'RE AT. BUT WE HEARD FEEDBACK EXTENSIVELY, SO I DON'T KNOW IF A THOUSAND IS THE RIGHT NUMBER 500, BUT I ALMOST I DON'T MEAN TO INTERRUPT, BUT I ALMOST FEEL LIKE IT SHOULDN'T BE NEAR ANY RESIDENT, ANY RESIDENTS. I MEAN, IT'S A IT'S A COMMERCIAL USE. IT'S A WELL LIT USE. YEAH. IT PEOPLE DON'T WANT IT THERE. THERE'S THE POTENTIAL FOR SPRAY. THERE'S SALT. YOU'RE GOING TO GET TRAFFIC. NO IT'S NOT I WOULD AGREE THAT WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE REINFORCING THE DISTANCE. I'M THE COMPETITIVE MARKETPLACE. I DON'T KNOW HOW I FEEL ABOUT THE THOUSAND FEET FROM ANOTHER SUCH FACILITY. I THINK THAT COMES BACK TO WHERE'S THAT MAP? IT WOULD BE HELPFUL TO UNDERSTAND, BECAUSE WHAT WE'VE GOT TO DO IS FIGURE OUT WHETHER OR NOT THAT THAT LEAVES ANYWHERE LEFT. BUT I WOULD AGREE THIS THE 200FT AND THEN ANY DEVIATION FROM IT IS IS PROBLEMATIC. SO UPPING THAT. YEAH I MEAN RESPECTFULLY THIS BOARD TOOK IT IN THE ON THE CHIN IN THE GUT. I MEAN WE HEARD PLENTY ABOUT THE ONE CAR WASH AGAIN THAT DIDN'T GO THROUGH. DID I MENTION THAT ALREADY THAT IT DIDN'T GO THROUGH. YOU KNOW, AND IT WAS CLOSE TO A RESIDENCE. AND I THINK THAT WE KNOW WHAT THE CONCERNS ARE. WE'VE DONE THE STUDIES. THIS BOARD HAS HAD EXTENSIVE DISCUSSIONS ABOUT IT. AND I FEEL THAT 500FT IS NOT THE RIGHT IS NOT THE RIGHT DISTANCE. I CAN I CAN DEFINITELY PROVIDE THAT MAP THAT HAS THAT C2 ZONING OVERLAID ONTO IT. I THINK THAT WILL DEFINITELY HELP OUT. MY JOB IS TO BE DEVIL'S ADVOCATE. I THINK WE CAN OBVIOUSLY RECOMMEND 1000FT. I THINK LOOKING AT EXISTING C2 AND WE'RE RESIDENT, WE'RE RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORHOODS ARE IN RELATION TO THAT. C2 WILL BE HELPFUL BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, THERE'S A THERE'S A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN, YOU KNOW, 200FT AND 1000FT FROM A RESIDENCE. SO I REALLY THINK THAT MAP AND I THINK I MIGHT ALSO OVERLAY R1, R2, AND R3 ON THAT MAP AS WELL, BECAUSE THOSE ARE IN R4, BECAUSE THOSE ARE OUR EXISTING RESIDENTIAL DISTRICTS. JUST TO KIND OF GIVE AN OVERVIEW OF, ALL RIGHT, WHERE'S THE C2? WHERE ARE EXISTING RESIDENTIAL DISTRICTS? AND I THINK THAT

[00:35:04]

THERE'S TWO, TWO MORE. OKAY. THREE MORE. SORRY. AND THEN WE'LL BE DONE. IF YOU LOOK AT THE NEXT PAGE. 280 DASH 330 2.2. PRIVATE RENTAL, MINI STORAGE, PUBLIC MINI STORAGE, SELF SERVICE STORAGE. YOU CHOOSE HOW YOU WANT TO DESCRIBE IT. ONE OF THE THINGS THAT AS I SAID, IF YOU IF YOU JUST GO ON FACEBOOK, YOU'LL HEAR THAT THE TOWN HAS NOTHING BUT PRIVATE MINI STORAGE AND SELF STORAGE PRODUCTS OR FACILITIES. AND ONE OF THE THINGS WE WANTED TO LOOK AT WAS WE WANTED TO LOOK AT OUR SPECIAL USE PERMIT STANDARD REGULATIONS. YOU'LL SEE THE THE MINOR CHANGES ARE THE DEFINITIONS. I THINK A LOT OF TIMES WHAT I'VE NOTED IS THAT PEOPLE GET CONFUSED BETWEEN THAT PRIVATE RENTAL STORAGE DEFINITION, THAT PUBLIC MINI STORAGE DEFINITION, AND THEN WHAT WE HAVE IN THE C2 WHERE IT SAYS, YOU KNOW, PUBLIC MINI STORAGE IS PROHIBITED, EXCEPT THESE KIND OF BUILDINGS AND AN ENCLOSED BUILDING, WHICH I THINK COMPLICATES THINGS. I KNOW WE'VE THERE HAVE BEEN APPLICANTS THAT HAVE COME TO THIS BOARD THAT HAVE SUGGESTED ONE THING, AND WE'VE LOOKED AT IT AND WE'VE HAD CODE ENFORCEMENT INTERPRETED ONE WAY AND WE'VE LOOKED AT IT ANOTHER. SO I THINK SPECIFYING THE LANGUAGE IN TERMS OF THE ACTUAL REGULATIONS THEMSELVES, YOU'LL SEE THERE ARE NO CHANGES. I THINK ONE OF THE MISCONCEPTIONS IS THAT THE CHANGES OR SOME OF THE THE PROJECTS THAT A LOT OF THE PUBLIC HAS NOT LIKED ARE ACTUALLY THOSE EXACT TYPE OF PROJECTS I TALKED ABOUT THAT ARE ALLOWED IN C2, WHERE IT'S THESE STORAGE PROJECTS THAT ARE NOT QUOTE UNQUOTE, PRIVATE RENTAL STORAGE THAT ARE STORAGE IN AN ENCLOSED BUILDING, AND THERE ARE NO DESIGN GUIDELINES FOR IT. THERE WAS A PROJECT THAT WAS RECENTLY APPROVED OVER ON SOUTH PARK, SOUTH PARK BY SOUTHWESTERN, THAT IS A STORAGE PROJECT THAT WAS ZONED C2. THAT'S NOT PRIVATE RENTAL MINI STORAGE. THAT IS A STORAGE PROJECT WITHIN AN ENCLOSED BUILDING THAT WAS APPROVED IN C2. SO WHEN WE LOOKED AT THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT STANDARDS AND THE COMMITTEE'S OPINION, THERE WAS NOTHING TO CHANGE. I THINK THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT STANDARDS FOR PRIVATE RENTAL MINI STORAGE. SUFFICE TO MY KNOWLEDGE, THERE HASN'T BEEN ANY ISSUES WITH THOSE EXISTING FACILITIES, SO THERE WERE NO RECOMMENDATIONS OTHER THAN KIND OF CLEANING UP HOW WE CALL IT.

OTHER THAN THAT, THERE WERE NO OTHER RECOMMENDATIONS FOR THAT USE FOR SPECIAL USE PERMIT STANDARDS. ANY THOUGHTS? QUESTIONS? BILL CLARK HERE. SO I'M I'M ON SEE WHERE IT'S THE LOCATIONS ARE PROHIBITED. DO WE WANT TO ADD. AND NOW THAT I'M LOOKING AT IT DO WE WANT TO ADD IT. SO IT LOOKS SIMILAR TO A AND ADD MCKINLEY. OH ADD MCKINLEY AS WE DID IN THE CAR

[00:40:06]

ROUTE FIVE IS THERE. SO YOU WANT TO ADD MCKINLEY. RIGHT. AND THEN WE. AND THEN YOU CAN TAKE THE WATERFRONT AREA AND ADD IT TO THE CAR WASH. IS THAT A SUGGESTION THAT A LOT OF OTHER BOARD MEMBERS WOULD LIKE TO RECOMMEND AS WELL? WASN'T ZONED FOR THAT. I DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S ANY AREA ZONED FOR THAT ALONG THE WATERFRONT. NO, THERE, THERE THERE IS C2 WITHIN THE WATERFRONT AREA. OKAY. THERE IS C2, THERE IS C2. OH ALRIGHT THEN. YES, I MEAN WITHOUT WITH ROUTE FIVE BEING OFF THE TABLE I DON'T KNOW HOW. YEAH. THE WATERFRONT AREA. YEAH. THE WATERFRONT AREA IS NOT JUST ROUTE FIVE. THE WATERFRONT AREA IS EVERYTHING FROM THAT LACKAWANNA HAMBURG BORDER ALL THE WAY TO 18 MILE CREEK INTO THE VILLAGE. SO IT EXTENDS A VERY LONG WAY. SO THERE DEFINITELY IS C2 WITHIN THE WATERFRONT AREA. SO THE SUGGESTION IS TO ADD MCKINLEY PARKWAY TO MINI STORAGE IS PROHIBITED. BUT THEN ADDING THE WATERFRONT AREA TO CAR WASHES IS BEING, I GUESS A SIMPLE WAY TO EXPLAIN IT IS IF WE DON'T WANT CAR WASHES IN THIS AREA, WE DON'T WANT MINI STORAGE, WE DON'T WANT MINI STORAGE. WE ALSO DON'T WANT CAR WASHES. SO FOR PROHIBITING IT FROM AREAS, WE CAN PROHIBIT BOTH OF THEM FROM THE SAME AREAS. THAT'S THAT'S MY SUGGESTION. I AGREE WITH THAT. AND WE HAVE TO TAKE A LOOK. WE'LL CAN PUT THAT WITH THE MAP WHEN WE GET THE WHEN WE BRING THIS BACK. AND THEN THE LAST TWO PARTS OF THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT STANDARDS THAT YOU'LL SEE ARE ON THE BACK PAGE.

WAIT, I HAVE MORE ON THAT. OH, SORRY. GO AHEAD. IT'S OKAY. I'M JUST NOT JUMPING IN FAST ENOUGH.

OKAY. SO I'M JUST TRYING TO UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE DOING HERE BECAUSE. SO WE'RE WE'RE CHANGING PRIVATE RENTAL STORAGE TO JUST RENTAL STORAGE. BUT THEN THERE IS A PARENTHETICAL THAT HAS AN AKA. HERE'S A BUNCH OF OTHER WORDS WHICH YOU KNOW, I HATE PARENTHETICALS BECAUSE IF THE LANGUAGE IS SUPERFLUOUS, WHY IS IT THERE? BUT IF YOU IS IT BECAUSE MINI STORAGE AND SELF SERVICE STORAGE ARE USED LIKE OTHER PLACES THROUGHOUT THE CODE? AND THIS IS JUST A CATCH ALL. IT'S IT'S IN OUR WORD DEFINITIONS AS WELL. SO PRIVATE RENTAL STORAGE HAS A DEFINITION IN OUR WORDS AND DEFINITION SECTION. AND IT INCLUDES THIS PARENTHETICAL OF AKA PUBLIC MINI STORAGE SELF SERVICE STORAGE FACILITY. BUT IN TERMS OF OTHER PARTS OF THE CODE, IT JUST SAYS PRIVATE RENTAL MINI STORAGE. AND THEN IT SAYS IN PARENTHESES SEE DEFINITION. SO WOULDN'T IT JUST BE CLEANER THEN INSTEAD OF HAVING THIS SORT OF AKA. AND YOU CAN IGNORE ME FOR BEING ANNOYING, BUT JUST CALL IT PRIVATE RENTAL STORAGE AND THEN HAVE A PRIVATE RENTAL. STORAGE INCLUDES AND NAME THE THINGS THAT IT INCLUDES AS PER THE DEFINITION IN SECTION, BLAH BLAH BLAH. INSTEAD OF HAVING THIS AKA WITH OTHER WORDS YEAH, I THINK WE CAN WE CAN EITHER DO THAT OR WE CAN DO WE CAN CHANGE IT IN THE WORDS AND DEFINITIONS AND REMOVE IT FROM THERE AND THEN JUST SAY SEE DEFINITION IF THAT MAKES SENSE. SO LIKE IT'LL KILL, IT'LL CROSS OUT THE PARENTHETICAL, IT'LL SAY RENTAL. SO IT'LL ALSO WON'T SAY PRIVATE RENTAL STORAGE, RENTAL STORAGE. AND THEN LIKE THAT. AND THEN THE DEFINITION ITSELF. BECAUSE PART OF THIS IS ALSO SO THE REASON WE'RE ALSO REMOVING LIKE CHANGING THE LANGUAGE SLIGHTLY IS THAT WE'RE ALSO CHANGING THE DEFINITION OF RENTAL STORAGE. SO RENTAL STORAGE IS GOING TO HAVE A SET DEFINITION. AND THEN WE'RE ALSO I THINK I SHOWED IT TO YOU GUYS TWO MEETINGS AGO WHEN WE WENT OVER INDUSTRIAL REZONINGS IS WE'RE CHANGING THAT THAT USE IN C2 THAT ALLOWS THAT DOESN'T ALLOW PRIVATE RENTAL MINI STORAGE, BUT SAYS EXCEPT FOR AN ENCLOSED BUILDING, WE'RE REMOVING THAT LANGUAGE ENTIRELY AND SPECIFYING WHAT TYPES OF STORAGE BUILDINGS ARE ALLOWED IN C2 AS OF. RIGHT. AND THEN THIS RENTAL STORAGE IS GOING TO HAVE A DEFINITION, WHICH WILL BE THAT PUBLIC MINI STORAGE AKA ALL OF THAT. BUT WE'LL JUST CROSS IT OUT AND SAY SEE DEFINITION. YOU SHOULDN'T SAY SEE DEFINITION BECAUSE WE DON'T SAY IT ANYWHERE ELSE. IF THE DEFINITION EXISTS, THAT SHOULD BE GOOD ENOUGH. YEAH, THAT THAT'S FINE TOO, BUT I JUST I THINK THE AKA IS CONFUSING. AND IF IT IS RENTAL STORAGE IS A DEFINED TERM, THEN I WOULD JUST CALL IT RENTAL STORAGE. AND IF YOU WANT TO DOES INCLUDE BLAH BLAH BLAH.

BUT IF THAT'S IN THE DEFINITION THEN AGREED, YOU DON'T NEED TO SEE THE DEFINITION. YOU CAN JUST LOOK IT UP. I JUST THINK ALL THE WORD, ALL THE VARIOUS TERMS WITH WHICH WE USE TO TALK ABOUT RENTAL STORAGE IS CONFUSING. AND SIMILARLY, I KNOW YOU HAVEN'T GOTTEN TO THE NEXT ONE YET, BUT WHEN WHEN YOU DO, IF YOU CIRCLE BACK TO RENTAL STORAGE, RENTAL STORAGE DOESN'T. NOW THE MINI STORAGE OR RENTAL STORAGE OR WHATEVER IS IS LACKING. THAT SORT OF JUST LIKE I DON'T KNOW THE WORDS THAT I WANT TO USE THE LIKE PHYSICAL DESCRIPTION OF THE BUILDING THAT NOW FULL SCALE HAS. AND SO IT'S LIKE, WHY DOES FULL SCALE HAVE A MINI DOZEN? BUT MAYBE IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE FOR MINI, RIGHT. BUT I'M JUST PUTTING THAT OUT THERE.

BUT IT'S NOT MINI, IT'S JUST RENTAL STORAGE. SO WHY ISN'T IT ALL JUST THE SAME I DON'T KNOW.

[00:45:02]

MARGO, WE ARE CALLING THIS RENTAL STORAGE. BUT THEN IN EVERY SUBSECTION UNDER 280 DASH 330 2.2, IT'S CALLED MINI STORAGE UNITS. I THINK WE NEED TO CALL IT ONE THING OR THE OTHER THROUGHOUT. I AGREE AND NOT SWITCH THE NAME AND THEN MAKE SURE THAT THE DEFINITIONS ARE CLEAR, BECAUSE THIS IS PROBABLY ONE OF THE MOST CONFUSING THINGS. I DON'T KNOW THAT WE NO ONE REALLY USES THE PHRASE MINI STORAGE EXCEPT FOR US IN THIS PLANNING BOARD, SO MAYBE IT'S A SELF STORAGE. WE GOTTA COME UP WITH WHATEVER WE'RE WE GOTTA WE CAN. I AM CONFIDENT THAT WE CAN MAKE IT CLEARER. IT'S ACTUALLY THE SAME ABOVE. SO 330 2.1 SAYS PRIVATE RENTAL STORAGE BUT IT'S EXCLUSIVELY ABOUT OUTDOOR STORAGE. SO WHAT YOU ACTUALLY HAVE IS 332. ONE IS OUTDOOR STORAGE. 332 TWO IS MINI STORAGE. 332 THREE THEN BECOMES BREWERIES, AND THEN WE SKIP OVER BREWERIES AND GO. 332 FIVE FULL SCALE STORAGE. 332 SIX THAT'S DIFFERENT THING. SO THEY MIGHT JUST BE ABLE TO BE RENAMED AND NOT HAVE THIS CATCH ALL RENTAL STORAGE OR, I DON'T KNOW, GIVE IT A HEADING AND REDO THE NUMBERING FOR THE SUBS OR SOMETHING. ANY OTHER THOUGHTS? SORRY, WE'RE LIKE THIS. NO, IT HELPS WITH THE. NO, NO, IT'S VERY HELPFUL. YEAH. YEP. SO THIS ONE WILL WILL TABLE AND BRING TO TABLE THAT.

AND THEN THE LAST ONE I PROMISE 280 DASH 330 2.6. THAT'S THAT MIXED USE BUILDINGS IN THE NC DISTRICT THAT I MENTIONED THAT WE WERE ADDING AS A USE WITH A SPECIAL USE PERMIT. WE HAVE IN THERE THE LANGUAGE THAT IT NEEDS TO MEET THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE STANDARD SPECIAL USE PERMIT. AND THEN SPECIFICALLY WHAT IT ALSO NEEDS TO MEET IS THAT THERE'S A PROVISION OF APPROPRIATE PARKING AS LIMITED BASED ON THE INTENT SECTION OF THE NC DISTRICT ARCHITECTURAL FEATURES TO MEET THE CHARACTER OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD, INCLUDING PITCHED ROOFS, APPROPRIATE WINDOWS, THE SCALE OF THE BUILDING SHALL BE IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE INTENT OF THE DISTRICT AS DETERMINED BY THIS BOARD, AND THEN LANDSCAPING AND BUFFERS WILL BE DETERMINED BY THIS BOARD. WITH THE INTENT BEING THAT NOT HAVING TOO MANY SPECIFICS, BUT KIND OF GIVING A LITTLE BIT MORE DISCRETION TO THIS BOARD ON A CASE BY CASE BASIS, AS WE GET IF WE WERE TO GET A MIXED USE RENTAL OR A MIXED USE BUILDING IN THE NC DISTRICT WITH A SPECIAL USE PERMIT, THAT THIS BOARD WILL HAVE A LITTLE BIT OF DISCRETION TO APPROPRIATELY GIVE RECOMMENDED RECOMMENDATION FOR BUFFERS, LANDSCAPING, SO ON AND SO FORTH. AND WITH THAT, THAT IS THE THREE PHASES OR THE THREE CODE UPDATES FROM THIS FIRST PHASE. FOR THE MEETING ON

[00:50:02]

OKAY. AND IF EVERYBODY'S READY I WOULD LIKE TO CALL THE OFFICIAL MEETING FOR SEPTEMBER 3RD, 2025 FOR THE PLANNING BOARD TO ORDER AND PLEASE RISE FOR THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE. I PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS. ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL. MEMBER SHIMARA WOULD YOU PLEASE CALL THE ROLL? WILLIAM CLARK, PRESIDENT.

KATELYN SHIMURA, PRESIDENT. KIM RYAN, PRESIDENT. AUGIE GERACI ABSENT AND EXCUSED. CINDY GROENEKAN, PRESENT. KATELYN MCCORMICK HERE. MARGO VALENTE HERE. OKAY. WE HAVE A PRETTY PACKED AGENDA I WILL BRING TO THE BOARD'S ATTENTION. CASE NUMBER THREE. JOHN BROOKS. AM I PRONOUNCING THAT CORRECTLY, JOHN BROCK. BROCK'S WILL NOT BE IN FRONT OF US TONIGHT. HE DID NOT MAKE IT TO THE ZONING BOARD. AND SO HIS CASE IS POSTPONED INDEFINITELY AT THIS POINT UNTIL WE HEAR FROM THE APPLICANT. CORRECT. SO WE HAVE FOUR CASES. AND OUR FIRST CASE

[1. Benderson Development – Requesting Site Plan Approval of a proposal for parking adjustments at 3670 McKinley Parkway]

JOSH, DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD AT THIS POINT? NOTHING OTHER THAN TO REMIND THIS BOARD.

WE'VE HAD A PUBLIC HEARING SO FAR. THIS BOARD DID AUTHORIZE ME TO PRODUCE SITE PLAN APPROVAL RESOLUTIONS FOR THIS PROJECT. EVERYONE IN THE SHAREPOINT FOLDER SHOULD HAVE RECEIVED THE ELECTRONIC COPY OF THOSE AMENDMENTS THAT MR. OATES JUST EXPLAINED. AND I HAVE THE RESOLUTION FOR DISCUSSION PURPOSES WHEN READY. AND I CAN ALSO BRING UP I ALSO HAVE A HARD COPY, A FULL, HARD COPY OF THAT PLAN IF ANYONE WANTS ONE, I HAVE ONE ENGINEERING. DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING TO OFFER? NO. NOTHING HAD. OKAY. PLANNING BOARD, BOARD MEMBERS, DO YOU HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS? COMMENTS? MR. OATES, COME OVER HERE AND HELP ME FIND THE STOP SIGN. CAN WE PUT THAT UP ON THE. SO. YEP. SO ON. SEE 4.1 WE NOW HAVE THERE IS A STOP SIGN HERE.

THERE AND ON THE BECAUSE THERE IS A CAN YOU HIGHLIGHT IT. SO IT'S THE 11 THERE AND THEN THERE. BUT IT'S NOT ACTUALLY ON FOR SOME REASON. IT'S NOT ON THE HARD COPY BECAUSE IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE THERE. SO IF YOU LOOK AT THE SCREEN, THE ELECTRONIC COPY DOES HAVE IT.

DOES THIS ONE. YOU CAN'T. OKAY. IT'S NOT ME. THANK YOU. ONE THAT JOSH EMAILED. YOU CAN ZOOM IN. RIGHT. BECAUSE I LOOKED AT THE ONE ON THE SHAREPOINT AND I YEAH, YOU KNOW WHAT? THAT ONE

[00:55:05]

AND THEN I GO TO THE SCREEN. IT'S NO LONGER THERE BUT I CAN I CAN PLAY VANNA AND POINT MYSELF. OKAY. SO THERE'S A STOP SIGN THAT'S GOING TO BE HERE. THERE'S ANOTHER STOP SIGN THERE, AND THEN THERE'S ANOTHER STOP SIGN THERE. SO IT WOULD BE THE THREE DRIVE LANES COMING IN TO WHERE THE INTERSECTION IS. ALL HAVE STOP SIGNS IN ADDITION TO THE STOP BARS. AND ALL THE REST OF THEM HAVE STOP BARS. OKAY. AND THEN THIS IS BASED ON WHAT YOUR TRAFFIC ENGINEER RECOMMENDED. THESE WERE THE CHANGES SINCE THE BEFORE THESE WERE DISCUSSED AT THE LAST MEETING, CORRECT? YES. WITH THE ADDITION BECAUSE THERE WAS ONE OF THOSE DID NOT HAVE A STOP SIGN. SO THAT'S WHY WE ADDED THE THIRD. YES. OKAY. AND THEN THE SNOW PILE EXCLUSION ZONE THAT BOARD REQUESTED. OKAY. ANYONE ELSE. I THINK THERE'S ANOTHER OH WHERE'S MIKE I STOLE IT. YOU TOO, I'M TELLING YOU, IS ENGINEERING IS IT ADEQUATE THAT THE DATE ON THESE DRAWINGS STILL SAYS MARCH 19TH ON THE BOTTOM, BUT THE REVISIONS ARE 828. I'M WONDERING IF THE WHOLE PLAN SET NEEDS TO BE DATE UPDATED. THE REVISION DATES ARE PRETTY TYPICAL OF WHAT WE SEE IN ENGINEERING, BECAUSE OFTEN, YOU KNOW, WE GO THROUGH MULTIPLE SETS, AS YOU'VE SEEN.

AND WHAT'S NICE ABOUT THE REVISION DATES IS IT DOES TRACK SPECIFICALLY WHAT THE CHANGES WERE. SO I THINK IF YOU READ THE LAST ONE IN MY REFERENCE, LIKE THE PLANNING BOARD MEETING ON THIS DAY TO ADDRESS COMMENTS. SO IT IS SOMETIMES A LITTLE EASIER TO FIND THINGS WHEN YOU DO HAVE THE REVISION DATES. SO I'M USED TO WORKING WITH THAT SO I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH IT. OKAY. ANYTHING ELSE. SO SO TO THAT POINT IN THE RESOLUTION, ARE WE GOING TO CALL OUT SITE PLAN DATED WITH THE MARCH DATE OR WITH THE REVISION NUMBER THREE WITH THE 444 AUGUST 28TH? THAT'S NUMBER THREE. SO, SO WE GOT THE. SO IT'S FOUR. OH I, I SEE IN OTHER COMMUNITIES AS WELL THAT THEY ACTUALLY DO BOTH DATES. THEY WOULD SAY PLAN SET DATED MARCH 19TH, 2025 REVISION NUMBER FOUR DATED AUGUST 28TH. AND THEY'LL LITERALLY REFERENCE BOTH OF THEM. SO YOU HAVE THE ORIGINAL DATE AND THE MOST CURRENT REVISION DATE AS WELL. OKAY. SO BUT THIS DOESN'T HAVE THE RIGHT. NO, THAT'S THE CORRECT ONE. THIS ONE'S FROM JULY OKAY. THAT IS THE CORRECT ONE WITH THE SNOW PILES AND THE. EXCUSE ME. YEAH. SO THAT'S ENGINEERING. SO YOU'RE GOING TO ADD THAT. BACK UP. JOSH DO WE WANT TO PUT THAT IN ONE OF THE WHEREASES. BECAUSE IT'S THERE'S MORE THAN JUST THE SNOW PILES IN THAT CHANGE THAT WE WANT INCORPORATED. RIGHT. SO THE STOP SIGNS AS WELL. THEY'RE ALSO NOT A CONDITION ANYMORE. THEY'RE IN THE SITE PLAN SO THEY DON'T NEED TO BE A CONDITION. SO YOU REMOVE YOU WANT TO REMOVE FOUR IN ITS ENTIRETY. YES OKAY. SO JUST FOR CLARIFICATION, WE'RE REMOVING THE SNOW PILE BECAUSE THAT IS ADDRESSED ON THE SITE PLAN BY THE APPLICANT. WHILE I'M DOWN HERE. ARE THERE ANY OTHERS THAT YOU WANT TO ADD TO THIS TO THIS RESOLUTION? NO, I DON'T THINK SO. ANYBODY ELSE? NO. AND THEN, CAMI, DO YOU HAVE THE DATE OF YOUR ENGINEERING COMMENT? THE ENGINEERING LETTER WILL BE 829, AND IT DOES REFERENCE THE SITE PLAN WITH THE REVISION DATE. YEAH, THAT'S JUST AVIATION.

BILL, DO YOU WANT TO SPELL OUT OR SAY HOW YOU WANT THAT. WHEREAS CLAUSE TO READ.

[01:00:18]

DOES THAT WORK OKAY? DOES THAT MEAN YOU'RE READING THAT AND MAKING A MOTION MEMBER? CLARK, SEE HOW HE WALKED RIGHT INTO THAT? OKAY, OKAY, SO BENDERSON PARKING LOT EXPANSION 3670 MCKINLEY PARKWAY SITE PLAN APPROVAL RESOLUTION. WHEREAS THE TOWN OF HAMBURG PLANNING BOARD RECEIVED A SITE PLAN APPLICATION FROM BENDERSON DEVELOPMENT COMPANY, LLC FOR PARKING LOT IMPROVEMENTS AT 3670 MCKINLEY PARKWAY. AND WHEREAS, THE TOWN OF HAMBURG PLANNING BOARD HELD THE REQUIRED PUBLIC HEARING ON MAY 7TH, 2025. AND WHEREAS THE TOWN OF HAMBURG PLANNING BOARD HAS REVIEWED THE PROJECT AGAINST THE TOWN CODE, HAS RECEIVED INPUT FROM TOWN DEPARTMENTS AND OTHER AGENCIES, HAS RECEIVED ADDITIONAL INFORMATION REPORTS FROM THE APPLICANT, AND PROVIDED INPUT TO THE APPLICANT THAT HAS RESULTED IN AMENDED PLANS ADDRESSING THE PLANNING BOARD'S CONCERNS AND ADD IN THEIR DATED AUGUST 28TH, 2025.

AND WHEREAS, IN ACCORDANCE WITH PART 617 OF THE IMPLEMENTING REGULATIONS PERTAINING TO ARTICLE EIGHT, STATE ENVIRONMENTAL QUALITY REVIEW ACT, SEEKER OF THE ENVIRONMENTAL CONSERVATION LAW, THE TOWN OF HAMBURG PLANNING BOARD HAS DETERMINED THAT THE PROJECT IS A TYPE TWO ACTION, AND NO FURTHER SECRET ANALYSIS IS REQUIRED AND. WHEREAS THE APPLICANT SUBMITTED A SITE PLAN ON MARCH 19TH, 2025 AND AMENDMENTS UP TO AMENDMENT FOUR DATED AUGUST 28TH, 2025, AND NOW THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, THE TOWN OF HAMBURG PLANNING BOARD ISSUES CONDITIONAL SITE PLAN APPROVAL FOR THIS PROJECT WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS ONE. APPROVAL IS CONTINGENT UPON THE ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT COMMENT LETTER DATED AUGUST 29TH, 2025 TWO. THE FINAL LANDSCAPE PLAN SHALL BE APPROVED BY THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT. THREE. SIDEWALKS ARE NOT WARRANTED AS THEY ALREADY EXIST WITHIN THE PLAZA.

SO IT'S BEEN MOVED. IS THERE A SECOND? SECOND? IT'S BEEN THE MOTION MADE BY MEMBER CLARK, MOVED BY MEMBER SHIMURA. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR? AYE. ANY OPPOSED? NONE. YOUR RESOLUTION IS GRANTED. GOOD LUCK. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU. SO OUR NEXT CASE IS NEWTON ABBOT FIRE

[2. Newton Abbott Fire Company, Inc – Requesting Site Plan Approval of a proposal for a Conex box-based live fire training facility to be located at 3426 Abbott Road]

[01:05:04]

YEAH, I THINK THAT THIS NEEDS AN ACTUAL SITE PLAN FOR US TO DO A SITE PLAN APPROVAL. WHAT WOULD YOU LIKE? DO YOU JUST WANT THE LAYOUT? I MEAN, WHAT WE TYPICALLY HAVE, LIKE THE LAYOUT OF THE BUILDING ON A DRAWING LIKE THIS WITH WHERE THE PROPOSED PARKING IS GOING TO BE, AND IT SHOULD HAVE THE PROPERTY BOUNDARIES, THE SETBACKS, HOW FAR IT'S GOING TO BE FROM THE ADJACENT, LIKE THE STUFF THAT'S TYPICALLY ON A SITE PLAN. NORTH ARROW SCALE.

DO YOU HAVE A ARE YOU WORKING WITH ENGINEER ARCHITECT, ANYBODY? NO, NOT RIGHT NOW. THE ORGANIZATION THAT WE'RE DOING HAS DONE THESE THEMSELVES, AND THEY'VE JUST BEEN ABLE TO PUT THEM IN. THEY HAVE NOT WORKED WITH A SITE PLAN OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT. I THINK YOU HAVE THE SITE PLANS FOR THE ACTUAL. FOR OUR PROPERTY LINES AND EVERYTHING ELSE LIKE THAT. SO.

RIGHT. DO YOU THINK THEY COULD OVERLAY THE LAYOUT OF THE BUILDING ON THAT? SO LIKE THAT SURVEY THAT YOU PROVIDED? I CAN PROBABLY DO THAT. OKAY. YEAH I MEAN IT IT YEAH I CAN DO THAT ALONG WITH JUST WHERE THE PARK THE PROPOSED PARKING IS GOING TO GO. YEAH. I MEAN THE PROPOSED PARKING IS GOING TO BE THE WHOLE BACK LOT AREA. OKAY. THAT'S THERE NOW. SO YEAH, HAVING ALL OF THAT WITH OUR STANDARD, YOU KNOW, STANDARD NORTH ARROW SCALE, ALL THAT.

OKAY. YEAH I'LL WORK WITH YOU ON THAT. OKAY. DO WE HAVE THE FULL APPLICATION AS WELL? I ONLY HAVE THE APPLICATION TO THE ZBA IN THIS FOLDER. YEAH. WE HAVE THE APPLICATION. WE HAVE HARD COPIES. I CAN PUT THE ELECTRONIC COPY IN THE, IN THE FOLDER. YEAH. AND THE CHECKLIST TOO FOR THE. I HAVE NO CONCERNS WITH HAVING A PUBLIC HEARING THOUGH WHILE WE PULL THOSE MATERIALS TOGETHER. BUT SO I, I THINK WHAT WE CAN DO IS IN ORDER TO MOVE FORWARD IS TO BE SURE THAT THE APPLICANT HAS ALL THAT INFORMATION TO US. WE CAN DOWNLOAD THE APPLICATION, THE HARD COPY INTO THE SITE PLAN FOR THE NEXT MEETING. I'M COMFORTABLE WITH ORDERING THE PUBLIC HEARING. I THINK THAT THE APPLICANT WILL DO HIS DUE DILIGENCE TO GET IT TO US BEFORE THE NEXT MEETING, SO. AND JOSH WILL HELP YOU WITH THAT. WE'LL HAVE IT BY FRIDAY.

OKAY. WELL, I DON'T NEED HIM. HE NEEDS THEM. AND THEN IS THERE ANY OTHER INFORMATION THAT ANY ANYONE ELSE WOULD LIKE TO SEE ON THIS? DOES THAT MEAN EVERYBODY'S CONCERNS OR ADDRESS EVERYONE'S CONCERNS? THAT'S FINE. I CAN'T SEE. MEMBER MCCORMICK. ARE YOU OKAY WITH EVERYTHING? AS LONG AS WE GET THE APPLICATION AND THEN IT MEETS ALL THE REQUIREMENTS FOR THE APPLICATION. I'M FINE. I JUST THINK WE NEED A SITE. A FORMAL SITE PLAN. YEAH, I THINK THEY'LL. WELL, WE'VE GOT IN OUR RECORD THAT THAT WILL BE DONE. I MEAN, IF IT'S NOT, THEN WE'RE NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO PROCEED. IT'S JUST THAT SIMPLE. BUT BECAUSE I DON'T THINK WE QUALIFY FOR A SITE PLAN WAIVER HERE. NO, NO. OKAY. SO GO AHEAD AND PUT IT ON THE 18TH MEETING.

17TH ON THE 17TH. WELL I'M GOING TO BE HERE ON THE 18TH. I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU GUYS ARE GOING TO DO, BUT ON THE 17TH AND IF YOU HAVE ANY PROBLEMS PLEASE REACH OUT TO JOSH. OKAY.

WILL DO. THANK YOU. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU. ALL RIGHT, SO OUR NEXT CASE IS NUMBER FOUR,

[4. Water Valley Gardens, LLC – Requesting a Change of Use and Site Plan Approval for a development at 6666 Gowanda State Road]

[01:10:04]

PERENNIAL PROPERTIES. SO OKAY. PLANNING DEPARTMENT OR. YEAH, PLANNING DEPARTMENT. DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD? AS YOU GUYS KNOW, THIS IS AN UNLISTED ACTION UNDER SEEKER. PREVIOUSLY FOR THE PREVIOUS PROPOSAL AT THIS SITE. YOU GUYS DID NOT DO A COORDINATOR REVIEW. BUT FOR THIS PROJECT, YOU DID ASK ME TO SEND IT TO THE NEW YORK STATE DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION, BECAUSE GOWANDA STATE ROAD IS A STATE ROAD. I DID DO THAT. CARL FROM THE NEW YORK STATE DOT DID PROVIDE SOME COMMENTS BACK. JUST SOME, YOU KNOW, PRELIMINARY COMMENTS, WHICH I BELIEVE I SENT TO THIS ENTIRE BOARD THAT I KNOW THE APPLICANT IS HAVING THEIR ENGINEER, CARMINA, WOULD TAKE A LOOK INTO. I DON'T KNOW IF ANYONE HAS ANY QUESTIONS ON THOSE COMMENTS FOR THE APPLICANT TODAY, BUT I DID SEND THOSE. OTHER THAN THAT, UNLESS THERE ARE ANY OTHER SPECIFIC REQUIREMENTS THAT YOU GUYS WANT OR ANY OTHER QUESTIONS ON THE PARKING ANALYSIS, THIS PROJECT STILL DOES NEED A PUBLIC HEARING TO BE SCHEDULED, AND YOU CAN DECIDE WHEN YOU WANT TO HOLD THAT, UNLESS YOU HAVE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS. JOSH, COULD YOU DO ME A FAVOR? COULD YOU GOOGLE THIS ADDRESS? AND DO I KNOW I REALIZE THAT THE BUILDINGS THEMSELVES LOOK A LITTLE DIFFERENT, BUT IT MIGHT BE HELPFUL IF WE GET A VISUAL WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SOME OF THIS STUFF. DO YOU MIND? SURE. ADDRESS IS (366) 666-6666. GO

[01:15:07]

DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? SO THE MAIN BUILDING, REMIND ME AGAIN THE HOURS OF OPERATION.

LIKE WILL THERE BE BRUNCH EVENTS TOO. SURE. SO THE MAIN SO THE MAIN BUILDING IS GOING TO BE HER. HER STORE HOURS ARE GOING TO BE WEDNESDAY THROUGH SUNDAY. HER HOURS ARE PROBABLY LIKELY TO BE 10 TO 6 IS WHAT SHE SAID TODAY FOR A CONVERSATION WITH HER. SO THOSE ARE LIKELY TO BE HER PRIMARY HOURS OF OPERATION. SO THE MAIN BUILDING IS JUST THE STORE, THE MAIN BUILDING, THE FIRST FLOOR OF THE MAIN BUILDING IS GOING TO BE ABOUT 1000FT■!S OF RETAIL SPACE. THERE'S ME TWO BATHROOMS. THE TWO BATHROOMS ARE SHARED BATHROOMS. RIGHT. SO ALL THE ALL THE PLAYERS SHARES THE BATHROOMS AT THE AIRBNB UPSTAIRS OR THE TWO BEDROOMS SUITE UPSTAIRS HAS ITS OWN BATHROOM SO IT DOES NOT SHARE THE BATHROOMS. RIGHT. SO UPSTAIRS OF THE MAIN BUILDING IS GOING TO BE I CAN KIND OF POINT IT OUT HERE TO YOU IF YOU WANT, IF YOU WANT TO ZOOM OUT. SO IF YOU'RE THE FIRST FLOOR THIS THE HERE IS THE MAIN BUILDING. AND THEN THE GREENHOUSE DOESN'T HAVE ITS OWN BATHROOM. SO IT WOULD BE GOING IN. AND THEN 6656. HERE IS WHAT THEY PURCHASED A FEW YEARS AGO. AND THEN SO WE NOW OWN THEN THIS ENTIRE AREA. AND THE AIRBNB IS THE SECOND FLOOR THERE. AND THEN THE RETAIL SPACE IS IN THE FRONT OF THIS ONE. BUT IN THE BATHROOMS ARE ON THE SIDE OF, OF THE FIRST FLOOR BEDROOM. YEAH. SO THE TWO BEDROOM SUITE HAS ITS OWN PLANNED SECOND ENTRANCE. SECOND ENTRANCE HAS A PRIVATE ENTRANCE TO THE TO THE TWO BEDROOM SUITE, JUST LIKE WE DID FOR WATER VALLEY NEXT DOOR HAS ITS OWN PRIVATE ENTRANCE INTO THE THREE BEDROOM SUITE. SO WHAT ELSE? WHAT OTHER USE IS IN THE MAIN BUILDING LIKE NOW? YOU SAID THE RETAIL SPACE IS JUST IN THE FRONT, SO IT'S IN THE BACK. SO THE WHEN I REFER TO THE FRONT, THE ENTIRE FIRST FLOOR OF THE BUILDING IS 1000FT■!S. OKAY. WIH THE EXCEPTION OF THE SMALL ADDITION TO THE LEFT OF IT, WHICH IS GOING TO BE BATHROOMS. OKAY. SO WE WE JUST EXCLUSIVELY HAVE A RETAIL SPACE. CORRECT.

AND THEN THE GREENHOUSE IS GOING TO BE THE PRIMARY. I'LL CALL IT AN EVENT SPACE FOR LACK OF A BETTER WORD. SURE. BUT IT'S NOT DOESN'T HOLD VERY MANY PEOPLE. THAT'S CORRECT. WE'RE NOT LOOKING FOR BIG EVENTS. AGAIN. WE'RE LOOKING FOR TO MAKE IT A SMALL BOUTIQUE STYLE, LIKE YOU FEEL LIKE YOU'RE WALKING TO A GARDEN CENTER. MAYBE YOU THINK OF THE BOTANICAL GARDENS, THE BOTANICAL GARDENS. RIGHT. SO THE BOTANICAL GARDENS HAVE A VERY NICE LITTLE EVENT SPACE THAT YOU CAN HAVE. IT'S A VERY SMALL SETUP. WE'RE NOT LOOKING TO HOST WEDDINGS THERE. RIGHT. BUT YOU CAN MAYBE DO A BABY SHOWER OR SOMETHING MUCH SMALLER SCOPE, MUCH MORE NEIGHBORHOOD FRIENDLY IN THAT GREENHOUSE SPACE. ANY WORKSHOP WOULD BE HELD IN THE GREENHOUSE OR IN THE MAIN BUILDING, MOSTLY IN THE GREENHOUSE, MOST NOT NECESSARILY. SO THERE'S LIKE A VERY SLIM CHANCE THAT YOU COULD HAVE A WORKSHOP IN THE MAIN BUILDING AND AN EVENT IN THE GREENHOUSE. SHE DOES NOT WANT TO HOST EVENTS ANY, ANY WORKSHOPS IN THE MAIN BUILDING, BECAUSE THE SQUARE FOOTAGE IS JUST TOO SMALL FOR THE RETAIL SPACE. IT'S A VERY SMALL RETAIL SPACE. AGAIN, IT'S 1000FT■!S. SO SHE DOES NOT WANT TO HOST ANYTHING THERE, BUT I CAN'T TELL YOU DEFINITIVELY. SO SHE HAS TOLD ME SHE INTENDS TO PLAN TO HOST EVERYTHING IN THERE. I CAN'T TELL IF SHE IF SHE HOSTS A SIX PERSON BASKET WEAVING IN THE FIRST FLOOR. I CAN'T PROMISE YOU THAT. SHE'S NOT GOING TO. SHE'S ONLY SIX.

PEOPLE SHOW UP THAT SHE'S GOING TO SHOVEL A PATHWAY TO A GREENHOUSE TO TO NOT, YOU KNOW, TO NOT HAVE TO DO THAT. RIGHT. YEAH. FOR SURE. I'M FOLLOWING. OKAY. I JUST I DON'T, I DON'T THINK THAT THE, I JUST DON'T THINK THE, THE PARKING RISK IS AS BIG AS WE TALKED ABOUT IT LAST TIME BASED ON THE USE. THE CAPACITY IS BUT NOT BASED ON THE USE. RIGHT? RIGHT. YOU KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING. OH EXACTLY. YEAH. YEAH. SO YES. OKAY. SO CONFUSED ABOUT THAT. THE ALLOWED VERSUS THE ACTUAL AND THE AND THE INTENTION HERE ARE THERE'S A SIGNIFICANT DIFFERENCE. AND IT'S JUST BECAUSE AT THIS POINT, YOU KNOW THEY HAD TO HAVE AND PARTICULARLY WORKING WITH CARMINA WOOD AND DUO DESIGN HAD TO HAVE THEIR CAPACITY. AND THEN SPECIFICALLY FOR THE BATHROOMS AND ALL OF THAT. BUT THE INTENDED USE IS GOING TO BE A SMALLER SCALE. AND THEN THE REALLY THE JOINT OWNERSHIP BETWEEN THE TWO AS AFFILIATED ENTITIES WITH COMMON OWNERSHIP IS THEN WHAT OPENS US UP NOT ONLY TO THE PARKING AND TO A SHARED PARKING AGREEMENT, BUT THEN ALSO THAT COLLECTIVELY, THIS ENTIRE CORNER AND PROPERTY HAS REALLY A COHESIVE, YOU KNOW, AGREEMENT ON ALL FRONTS. IT'S A KIND OF GO ALONG WITH THAT. SO THE WORKSHOPS AND THE SAY, A BABY SHOWER, THEY WON'T BE HAPPENING AT THE SAME TIME

[01:20:05]

CORRECT. AND I THINK I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE I MEAN, I DON'T WANT TO SPEAK FOR EVERYONE, BUT I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE MIGHT IF YOU GO TO LIKE, MY WIFE GOES TO BABY SHOWER WITH HER MOM, THEY'LL DRIVE TOGETHER TO THAT BABY SHOWER. SO IT'S TWO PEOPLE TO ONE CAR. AND EVEN IF YOU'RE SAYING A 50 PERSON EVENT, IF IT'S ON A SUNDAY AFTERNOON AT 2:00, RIGHT AS A BABY SHOWER, THEY HAVE FULL ACCESS TO THE EXTRA 22 SPOTS AT WATER VALLEY AS WELL. SO EVEN IF THE 36 SPOTS ISN'T ENOUGH ON THIS PROPERTY, THEY COULD OVERFLOW INTO THE 22 SPOTS. OKAY, MADAM MEMBER MCCORMICK, I HAVE SOME CONFUSION ABOUT THIS PARKING MEMO, AND I'M WONDERING IF YOU COULD MAKE SOME CLARIFICATIONS. SO THERE'S. I'M OUT OF TRAFFIC ENGINEER, BUT TYPICALLY THEY REFERENCE SOME APPLICABLE TRAFFIC FLOW STANDARDS AND ANALYSIS. SO IF IT'S A CERTAIN TYPE OF USE, THERE'S A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF TRAFFIC FLOW WILL BE HELPFUL FOR ME IS FOR YOU TO TAKE THE TYPICAL OCCUPANCIES AND TRANSLATE THAT USING THOSE TO WHAT THE THE TYPICAL THE TRAFFIC STANDARD NUMBER OF PARKING SPACES IS. I THINK WITH REGARD TO THE AIRBNB, OBVIOUSLY THAT'S GOING TO HAVE A MAXIMUM OCCUPANCY THAT YOU GUYS ARE GOING TO ALLOW SEPARATE FROM THE CODE BASED ON YOUR RENTAL AGREEMENTS, WHETHER THAT'S FOUR PEOPLE OR SIX PEOPLE YOU'RE NOT GOING TO, I PRESUME YOU'RE NOT GOING TO RENT IT TO 20 PEOPLE. IT WON'T BE MORE THAN SIX. YEAH.

SO I THINK MAKING SURE THAT WE ONE GET THOSE RATIOS IN AND THEN HAVING SOME SORT OF A DIAGRAM OF THE HOURS IN THE SPACES OF WHEN YOU EXPECT TO HAVE THESE EVENTS SO THAT WE CAN LAY OUT TEMPORALLY. BECAUSE I ASSUME THERE ARE A LOT OF TIMES WHERE THOSE WORKSHOPS AND EVENTS DO HAPPEN DURING THE WORK DAY, RETIREES, GARDEN CLUBS, AND THERE MAY BE SOME OVERLAP, BUT TRYING TO UNDERSTAND AND JUST YOU LAY OUT MAYBE A TABLE THAT SHOWS THE HOURS WHEN YOU'RE EXPECTING TO HAVE SOMEBODY PARKING. OBVIOUSLY THE AIRBNB, IF SOMEBODY RENTS, IT COULD BE ANY TIME. BUT LIKE WHAT THE HOURS OF OPERATION AND WHEN THOSE PARKINGS ARE KIND OF LAID OUT IN A TABLE RELATIVE FOR EACH OF THOSE USES AND THEN RELATIVE TO LADY BIRD, BECAUSE I'M, I'M STRUGGLING A LITTLE BIT. TO FOLLOW EXACTLY HOW MANY SPACES ARE NEEDED, AT WHAT TIMES OF DAY, WHERE, AND TO TO LINE UP ALL THESE PIECES TO TOGETHER.

THAT'S JUST MY WHERE I'M HAVING A LITTLE BIT OF CONFUSION BECAUSE WHAT I SEE IS THAT.

IT'S POSSIBLE TO HOST EITHER IN THE MAIN BUILDING OR AT THE GREENHOUSE, SUCH PEOPLE THAT EXCEEDS THE NUMBER OF PARKING SPACES. SO PUTTING IN THE EXTRA LEVEL OF LIKE WHAT IS THE RATIO BASED ON THOSE, THOSE TRAFFIC STANDARDS. AND THEN LAYING THAT OUT OVER TIME WILL HELP ME VISUALIZE WHAT YOU GUYS HAVE HERE. OKAY. ANYONE ELSE? I HAVE A QUESTION. THIS IS CHAIR GRUENHAGEN. SO IN REGARDS TO THIS LETTER FROM MDOT. NOW YOU TOOK THE PICTURE DOWN. SO THE DRIVEWAY TO THE RIGHT IN THIS PICTURE. THE DRIVEWAY TO THE RIGHT, ACCORDING TO THIS LETTER FROM. THE DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION, IF I SAID MDOT, MY DAYS OF MICHIGAN ARE COMING THROUGH AGAIN. BUT IT SAYS WE WANT A FIRM UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT IS HAPPENING WITH THE STORMWATER. WILL THERE BE LESS OR MORE OR LESS IMPERVIOUS SURFACE PROPOSED? WHERE WILL IT DISCHARGE AND DIRECT DISCHARGE THAT'S ON THE STORMWATER. AND THEN IT SAYS, IT SHALL BE NOTED THAT AND NEW YORK DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION POLICY, THAT WHEN ACCESS TO A PARCEL CAN BE

[01:25:05]

BUT THAT HERE, EVEN IF THEY TYPICALLY WOULD TRY TO GET US TO KNOCK DOWN TO ONE DRIVEWAY, WHAT WE ARE GOING TO, WHAT CHRIS CAN VERY REASONABLY DO IS DO THE MARKED AIRBNB SPOTS AND THE HANDICAPPED SPOTS IN THE NORTH LOT WITH THIS WITH THAT DRIVEWAY, AND THEN HAVE ALL THE REST OF THE PARKING WITH THE SECOND DRIVEWAY. AND SO NOT TO HAVE TO CUT US DOWN TO ONE. AND SO THEN THAT ADDRESSES THAT COMMENT. KARL HAD NOT YET RESPONDED. THIS HAPPENED THE 29TH AND 30TH. YEAH. THIS WAS THURSDAY OR FRIDAY OF LAST WEEK. YEAH. AND THEN BUT THAT CHRIS SAID HE PRETTY REGULARLY HAS TO WORK THROUGH THAT WITH DOT AND THESE STATE ROADS AND THAT HERE IT IT ACTUALLY WOULD NOT MAKE ANY SENSE WITH THE FLOW OF TRAFFIC TO HAVE TO HAVE TO REMOVE THE SECOND DRIVEWAY AND BECAUSE IT'S NARROW AND BECAUSE OF THE SPACING THAT YOU WOULD NEED FOR, FOR THE HANDICAPPED SPOTS. SO MY CLARIFICATION IS, ARE BOTH OF THOSE DRIVEWAYS SIX, SIX SIX, SIX. THEY BELONG TO THIS BUSINESS, CORRECT? OKAY. YEAH. YEAH. IS THERE. SO AND WHEN I WAS LOOKING AT THE AT THE PLAN. THIS PROPERTY OR THIS ENTRANCE, YOU WOULD DRIVE AROUND THE BUILDING TO GET INTO THE PARKING PLACE BASED ON WHAT THIS BECAUSE THE PARKING IS ON OFF OF SOUTH CREEK. TECHNICALLY CORRECT. THE PARKING AREAS EXTEND ALONG SOUTH SOUTH CREEK.

SORRY, BUT YOU'D. YES. JOSH, CAN YOU ZOOM OUT? JUST THIS. EVEN A COUPLE? SO OVER TO THE LEFT, YOU'LL SEE THAT YOU HAVE TO. WE WOULD BE EXTENDING OUR THE PARKING ALONG SOUTH CREEK THERE, YOU KNOW, HERE. BUT. RIGHT. BUT NOT BECAUSE WE ADD ANY ACCESS ON SOUTH CREEK. WE WOULD STILL CONTINUE. WE WOULD YOU'D GET IN FROM THAT. SO THEN THE TREES ARE COMING DOWN. THEN ALL THOSE TREES ARE GOING TO HAVE TO COME DOWN. NO, NO, WE'RE NOT GETTING RID OF THE TREES. WE CAN ACTUALLY WORK AROUND THE EXISTING TREES AS WE WANT TO DO. AGAIN, WE'RE GOING FOR LIKE A GARDEN CENTER TYPE FEEL HERE. SO WE'RE TRYING TO KEEP AS MUCH VEGETATION AS POSSIBLE AND MAKE IT NOT FEEL LIKE A PARKING LOT. SO THAT'S WHERE I WAS CONFUSED WHEN I WHEN I READ THIS, THIS LETTER AND THEN LOOKED AT THIS PLAN, I WAS I, I COULDN'T FOR SOME REASON I COULDN'T SEE IT. SO. WHEN YOU SAID SHARED PARKING, CAN YOU, CAN YOU CLARIFY THAT YOU SAID SHARED. SURE. SO SO WE OWN WATER VALLEY AND THE RIGHT NEXT DOOR. CAN YOU ZOOM TO THE RIGHT OF THAT AERIAL SO WE CAN SEE BOTH? THERE'S THERE'S TWO DRIVEWAYS RIGHT NOW. THERE'S TWO DRIVEWAYS INTO SIX, SIX, SIX, SIX. AND THERE'S ALWAYS BEEN TWO DRIVEWAYS SINCE SOUTH CREEK. NEVER ONE ON A SOUTH CREEK. THERE'S TWO. IT'S TOO MUCH. TOO MUCH OF A HILL TO PUT A DRIVEWAY ON SOUTH CREEK. SO IT'S KIND OF A WHEN A KARL, THE PERSON FROM THE DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION OR STATE DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION, MADE THE COMMENT, I THINK HE ACKNOWLEDGED THAT YOU COULD NOT PUT PARKING FROM THAT KIND OF A HILL GOING FROM SOUTH CREEK. HE MENTIONED THAT. SO OUR CONVERSATION WITH, WITH CHRIS, WHAT OUR, OUR ENGINEER BASICALLY SAID, EVERY SINGLE TIME THE STATE SEES TWO DRIVEWAYS, THEY WANT TO CUT DOWN TO ONE TO REDUCE IT. IN THIS CASE, THESE TWO DRIVEWAYS HAVE BEEN HERE FOR A VERY LONG TIME, AS THEY CURRENTLY STAND. AND EVEN MORE SO, IT MIGHT NOT MAKE SENSE TO REDUCE IT TO ONE DRIVE JUST BECAUSE THE AMOUNT OF SPACE YOU NEED. SO IF YOU NEED 18 SPACES, 18FT FOR A CAR'S LENGTH, OR AND THE OTHER AMOUNT NEEDED FOR A DRIVEWAY, THERE'S NOT ENOUGH SPACE IN FRONT OF THE BUILDING TO USE ONE DRIVEWAY WHERE I THINK WE HAVE A FULL JUSTIFICATION TO KEEP THE TWO DRIVEWAYS AGAIN, THAT HAVE BEEN THERE SINCE IT WAS A GARDEN CENTER WHEN THEY HAD, YOU KNOW, LARGE MACHINERY COMING IN AND OUT. WE HAD TRUCKS COMING IN AND OUT WITH

[01:30:03]

AND THERE'S A PARKING PARKING LOT AT LADY BIRD. RIGHT. SO THAT'S ANOTHER I THINK 17 SPOTS RIGHT THERE. AND THEN WE'RE ADDING THE 35 OR 36 SPOTS ALONG HERE. SO I THINK OUR PARKING, YOU KNOW, IS MORE THAN SUFFICIENT FOR ALL THE COMBINED USES, ESPECIALLY CONSIDERING, YOU KNOW, THERE'S NOT GOING TO BE A WORKSHOP AND AN EVENT GOING ON AT THE SAME TIME. HOW WOULD THEY GET THERE FROM THE LADY BIRD NOT OUT ON THE ROAD? IS THERE GOING TO BE AN ACCESS ON THE PROPERTY? WE ARE. THERE'S A PATH, OKAY. THERE'S A WALKWAY IN FRONT OF LADY BIRD, AND WE'RE ALSO ADDING A WALKWAY, A CONCRETE WALKWAY TO GO FROM LADY BIRD TO TO THE GREENHOUSE.

SPECIFICALLY, THERE'S SIDEWALKS. YEAH, SIDEWALKS. THANK YOU. OKAY. THAT WAS MY. THAT'S WHAT I NEEDED TO HAVE CLARIFIED. IS THERE ANYBODY ELSE THAT HAS QUESTIONS? CAN I MEMBER FINDLAY MEMBER RYAN. SORRY. YEAH, IT'S. WHAT CAN I TELL YOU? WHAT ARE THE OUR WHAT ARE THE HOURS OF LADY BIRD. SO RIGHT NOW THEY'RE THEY'RE 7 TO 3, BUT THEY OFTEN CLOSE EARLIER THAN THAT BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT BUSY AFTER TWO AND THEY'RE ALL SEVEN DAYS. NOPE. THEY ARE WEDNESDAY TO SUNDAY.

WEDNESDAY TO SUNDAY. CORRECT. OKAY. THANK YOU. MEMBER MCCORMICK. IF YOU ARE PROPOSING TO SEGREGATE THE PARKING FOR THE AIRBNB AND HANDICAP VERSUS THE OTHER, I THINK THAT ALSO PROBABLY NEEDS TO GET TAKEN INTO ACCOUNT IN THIS PARKING MAP. I'M SORRY, I'M JUST REALLY STRUGGLING TO MAP OUT IF THINGS HAVE OVERLAPPING HOURS AND THE SAME HOURS OF BUSINESS, AND THEN WHERE THE EVENTS ARE AND HOW THIS IS ALL GOING TO WORK. PARKING IS JUST A CHALLENGE THERE, ESPECIALLY WITH. I'M HOPING YOU'RE VERY SUCCESSFUL, BUT THEN ALSO UNDERSTANDING AS WELL HOW YOU'RE GOING TO. I KNOW YOU'RE PUTTING IN THE CONCRETE WALKWAY, BUT HOW ARE YOU GOING TO PREVENT PEOPLE FROM DRIVING ACROSS THE FRONT OF THIS PAVED AREA, OR ADDING LANDSCAPING OR SOME SORT OF THINGS TO GO ACROSS THE FRONT OF THIS BUILDING IN THAT AREA, BECAUSE YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE THOSE TWO DIFFERENT PARKING AREAS, AND IT LOOKS LIKE THERE'S JUST A CONCRETE PATH IN BETWEEN THEM. SO HOW ARE WE WITH CURVES OR OTHER MEASURES PREVENTING VEHICLES FROM CUTTING ACROSS THAT EXPANSE THAT COMES ACROSS THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING? SO THERE CURRENTLY ARE NO CURBS IF YOU ACTUALLY LOOK AT IT THERE, THE CURVES ARE ACTUALLY JUST PRETTY MUCH PRETTY FLUSH THAT THERE ARE CURRENTLY. AND THEN I MEAN ON THE ON THE PROPERTY. SO YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE TWO PARKING AREAS FROM YES, THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE THE TWO DRIVEWAYS THAT ARE RETAINED. SO THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE THE AREA THAT THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT IS THE AIRBNB PARKING WITH THE HANDICAP TO THE RIGHT OF WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT. RIGHT. WE'RE ASKING IF THAT'S A CONSIDERATION THAT THEY'LL TAKE. YEAH. SO THAT IS WHAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO DO. AND SO WHAT I'M ASKING IS ONCE YOU GET IN FROM THE SIDEWALK, HOW ARE YOU PREVENTING PEOPLE FROM GOING WHERE THAT CAR IS RIGHT NOW AND CUTTING ACROSS IN BETWEEN THE TWO ZONES OF PARKING AFTER THE SITE IS BUILT OUT? SURE. SO THERE'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT OPTIONS YOU CAN PUT RIGHT. YOU CAN PUT THE LITTLE PARKING BARRIERS THERE. YOU COULD PUT PLANTERS THERE. WE HAVEN'T DECIDED EXACTLY WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO YET BECAUSE WE'RE STILL WAITING FOR THE FINAL. HONESTLY, THE FINAL PLANS TO BE APPROVED BEFORE HAVING THAT STUFF TO TO DECIDE THE SPECIFICS OF IT. BUT WE DO CURRENTLY HAVE IF YOU LOOK AT OUR LANDSCAPE PLAN, THERE IS A PLAN. THERE CURRENTLY IS A PATHWAY IN THE LANDSCAPE. YEAH.

I WAS GOING TO SAY ON THE SITE PLAN THERE IS THE ORIENTATION OF THE PARKING IS OPPOSITE.

IT'S PERPENDICULAR TO HOW THAT CAR IS SITTING THERE, AND THAT THERE IS A PLANNED SIDEWALK THAT THAT RUNS ALONG THE FRONT FACE OF THE BUILDING, THAT THEN ALSO EXTENDS INTO THE EXISTING THE EXISTING SIDEWALK AND GOES ALL THE WAY AND THEN AND IT SPLITS WITH BY VIRTUE OF SIDEWALK PLANTING AND SO FORTH, AND THAT ALSO THERE'S A RADIUS OF A SIDEWALK TO THEN INCORPORATE, YOU KNOW, THE ADA PIECE. SO IT IS SEPARATED BY VIRTUE OF THE DESIGN. THAT'S CORRECT. AND ALSO, I'M JUST WONDERING IF WE HAD ALREADY APPROVED A PARKING PLAN FOR MORE INTENSE USE AT 40 SPOTS WITHOUT SHARED PARKING. I'M JUST CONCERNED ABOUT GOING ABOVE AND BEYOND WHAT WAS PREVIOUSLY APPROVED IN THE ADDITIONAL REQUEST AND TIME AND SO FORTH. I THINK MY CONCERN IS, IS I'M WONDERING IF THIS BECAUSE THEY'RE HOSTING EVENTS,

[01:35:07]

SO THAT WOULD BE PROJECT NUMBER SIX. OKAY. THIS IS MEMBER SHIMURA. JUST TO NOTE, IN THE PREVIOUS PARKING STUDY THAT WAS PROVIDED FOR PERENNIAL, IT SAID THAT WE DO NOT INTEND FOR THE OCCUPANCY OF THE BUILDING TO EXCEED 90 GUESTS AT ANY GIVEN TIME. YEAH, I THOUGHT IT WAS HIGHER. RIGHT. ALSO, JUST TO CLARIFY, FOR THOSE NEW YORK STATE DOT COMMENTS, THOSE WILL OBVIOUSLY ALSO BE ADDRESSED AT THE ENGINEERING STAGE, RIGHT? CAMIE YOU WILL LOOK INTO THE STORMWATER DRAINAGE AND ALL THOSE COMMENTS. SO I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THIS BOARD AND THEY'RE AWARE THAT THOSE COMMENTS WILL BE ADDRESSED, ESPECIALLY AT THE ENGINEERING PHASE FROM DOT. OKAY. SO WE'LL SEE YOU BACK ON THE 17TH WITH FUN AND GAMES I GUESS. THANK YOU. OKAY. THANK YOU, THANK YOU. OKAY. OUR FINAL. CASE THIS EVENING IS 3556 LAKESHORE

[5. 3556 Lakeshore Development LLC – Requesting Site Plan Approval for the development of a mixed-use site, offering condominiums and townhomes for residential use, and commercial uses, such as restaurants, hotel space, and continuing the use of some of the existing office space at the Gateway Building, to be located at 3556 Lake Shore Road ]

[01:40:16]

BUT AT LEAST TO HAVE THE MATERIALS IN TO YOU BY THEN, INTRODUCE THEM AT THAT MEETING AND THEN POTENTIALLY SCHEDULE A PUBLIC HEARING FOR EARLY OCTOBER. SO OUR OUR PLANS ARE TO DO THAT, FOLLOW THAT SCHEDULE. IT'S JUST A MATTER OF US, YOU KNOW, PUTTING BUTTONING THINGS UP ON OUR END. IS HE PART OF THE SIX? HE IS PART OF THE SIX. ALSO, JUST FOR CLARIFICATION, CONDOS, NOT TOWNHOMES, RIGHT? YEAH. CONDOS. CONDOS. IMMA KEEP IMMA KEEP YOU GUYS KEEP TELLING IT YOUR TERMS, OKAY? DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING ELSE? BECAUSE YOU ARE. YOU ARE THE PLANS CHANGING? NO, I MEAN THAT'S REALLY ABOUT MORE WAY OF DETAILS, BUT THE ONLY THING THAT'S BEEN A CHANGE, WE CALL IT A CHANGE IS WHEN WE LOOKED A LOT CLOSER AT THE POND THAT WAS SHOWN ON THE ONE CORNER. IT JUST BECAME A REALLY A MAINTENANCE CHALLENGE. SO THE CLIENT IS LOOKING TO ACTUALLY CHANGE THAT TO POOLS THAT WOULD BE OPEN TO THE PUBLIC. SO IT'D BE LIKE A MEMBERSHIP TYPE ARRANGEMENT RATHER THAN TRYING TO MESS AROUND WITH A POND OR A DAILY FEE POOL SITUATION. SO THAT'S JUST A LITTLE BIT OF A CHANGE THAN WHAT WE HAD PREVIOUSLY. IT'S STILL GOING TO HAVE THE POOLS THAT ARE ASSOCIATED WITH THE TOWER AND THE AND THE CONDOS, BUT THIS WOULD BE A DIFFERENT A DIFFERENT SETUP FOR DIFFERENT USERS. IT'S JUST THAT THE TRYING TO MAINTAIN A POOL OR A POND IN THAT AREA JUST BECAME PROBLEMATIC. OKAY, SO WE ALREADY HAVE YOU SCHEDULED FOR THE 17TH. IF FOR SOME REASON PLEASE LET JOSH KNOW AHEAD OF TIME, IF FOR SOME REASON YOU CAN'T MAKE IT AND THEN IF THERE'S NOTHING MORE, I DON'T KNOW THAT ANYBODY HAS ANY QUESTIONS BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE ANYTHING IN FRONT OF US. BUT YEAH, WE'LL SEE YOU BACK ON THE 17TH, OKAY? OKAY. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU. WE DON'T HAVE ANY MINUTES, DO WE? NOPE. OKAY. IS THERE OUR MINUTE ADMINISTRATOR? IS HE BEEN ON VACATION OR. THEY'RE A WORK IN PROGRESS? I CAN SAY THAT. OKAY.

ALRIGHT. WELL, IF THERE ISN'T ANYTHING ELSE, I NEED A MOTION FROM SOMEONE. I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO ADJOURN. SECOND, IT'S BEEN MOVED. AND SECOND, TO ADJOURN THIS MEETING. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR? AYE,

* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.